Development Journal: Diplomacy Improvements

In today’s dev journal, we take a look at the the improvements we’re making to Diplomacy.

Diplomacy Improvements

First we take a look at the new AI surrendering logic. Imagine the following situation: you have built a mighty empire, you are crushing everything your enemy can throw at you.  You are conquering his realm city by city. But still, no throne city in sight to end the reign of that puny lord. It looks like you are in for the long haul… or?

AISurrender

Yeah, that’s more like it, on your knees!

AI Surrender

AI surrender is one of the new free features that will be released simultaneously with the upcoming Golden Realms expansion. We want the game to finish with a bang, so to reduce any tedious slog during the end game, the AI will now consider surrendering to you (if this option is enabled in map setup). We don’t want to cut out the ‘epic final battle’ so this will only happen in situations where the AI is substantially outmatched and just lost a great number of its forces in a battle.

When you accept the surrender the leader will join your army as a hero and you will receive his throne city, including its defenders.  This will save you the time to do a mop up of his army and give you an edge when fighting other rivals. But if you really hate his guts and want to see his whole empire burn you can always just decline the surrender.

Trespassing

Another thing we’ve addressed is AI trespassing.  How did we do that? Well, the AI doesn’t do that anymore.  It will try to get an open border agreement with you when it really needs to get through your domain. That’s because trespassing is pretty scary now.  When one of your armies is trespassing it can now be attacked without a declaration of war. Even when you are at peace with someone it might not be smart to just waltz into his domain if you don’t have an open borders agreement.

AttackTrespasser

The patch will include a bunch more diplomacy improvements, ranging from interface improvements to more subtle AI changes. Like a messaging system where the AI will ask you not expand near its borders, and the way the AI handles declarations of war and peace proposals when it just met a player.

This is just the start of fixes we’re going to make to the diplomacy system. In future we’ll be looking to further improve the diplomacy AI.  Let us know what you think about these changes, and be sure to check back for another Dev Journal next week.

 

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Home Forums Development Journal: Diplomacy Improvements (AI Surrender!)

This topic contains 60 replies, has 32 voices, and was last updated by  Eric 4 years ago.

Viewing 30 posts - 1 through 30 (of 61 total)
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  • #119392

    Lennart Sas
    Keymaster
    #119395

    Link seems broken.

    Does this work instead?

    www.grababrew.weebly.com/

    #119399

    Lennart Sas
    Keymaster

    Sometimes WordPress updates the URL automatically after modifying a title – fixed.

    #119409

    Jolly Joker
    Member

    I’m pretty ecstatic about the changes, since the Diplomacy system really needed some attention!
    Man, I can’t wait for the patch (not to mention the additional downloadable not-free content 🙂 )

    #119419

    Ravenholme
    Member

    Sound excellent, and I am looking forward to the changes down the road as well to further improve the Diplomacy AI.

    I had been just thinking yesterday that an ability to attack trespassers without it being a declaration of war was needed, glad to see that Triumph felt the same way!

    “I am Welcomed in the Home of Ravens and Other Scavengers in the Wake of Warriors, I am Friend to Carrion Crows and Wolves, I am Carry Me, and Kill with Me, and Die with Me Where the Road Ends; I am not the Honeyed Promise of Length of Life in Years to Come, I am the Iron Promise of Never Being a Slave.”

    #119430

    Smaug3
    Member

    Sweet. I love that idea. Might be fun to trick five AI’s into surrendering.

    Something witty.

    #119431

    Riaktion
    Member

    This sounds excellent! Will the AI improvements and changes affect the existing single player campaign maps within vanilla AoW 3? Or is this just a change to the new campaign and random map generator?

    #119436

    Gloweye
    Member

    Really good ideas IMO! can’t wait for this to come. I’m playing a game of Dragon’s Throne at turn 80 and have just been professionally nailed by tresspassing AI I had peace with. Right now I’m building walls of watchtowers to keep him out, and that feels a bit…weird.

    #119437

    Leyrann
    Member

    This post made me think of something though – sometimes the AI builds a city like, right next to your current domain border (as in, they actually “steal” domain from you) while you’re trying to take a Heart or something with it. Do they still do this?

    #119446

    esvath
    Member

    When you accept the surrender the leader will join your army as a hero and you will receive his throne city, including its defenders.

    This is great! I hope that heroes from defeated leaders are not restricted by “maximum heroes number”, though. It would be better if they retain their spells!

    On trespassing, before we attack trespassing AI, could we give the AI gentle reminder? Something like: “Withdraw your troops from our territory!” warning in diplo screen? And, can they give us the same warning?

    Overall, cool feature, Triumph!

    #119447

    Bob5
    Member

    Does this mean that AI’s won’t trespass at all any more, or just a lot less because you can kick them out if they do? I think it’d be fun if AI’s can’t get a border agreement and they really want to travel through your domain (because it’s the only way or because circumventing is really far) they’d consider the risks and if the coast is clear they’d still try to do so, but if you have a decent army there that would pose a threat to them they wouldn’t.

    #119454

    Athei
    Member

    This is great Triumph! Keep up the good work!

    I have only 1 question though – what about random Declared war on their ally (-400) hate you get from Ai? Is that fixed as well or will your Ai allies still hate your guts after X number of turns?

    #119460

    Ericridge
    Member

    The more I learn of the golden realms the more I like it.

    #119463

    gooblaster
    Member

    I’m glad this is coming! I’d gotten real tired of ai just strolling though my borders when I couldn’t do anything about it without declaring war. This is great!

    #119467

    rohirrimelf
    Member

    Will there be another dev journal before release that tells us more about Defensive City Upgrades. Or patch notes for AI?

    Thanx for sharing this dev journal. The game could only get better with this.

    #119469

    Gloweye
    Member

    Following on the question about the random dislikes, I declared war on one of the AI’s(and killed him the turn after), and got around 8 modifiers of -300 at every other AI. Might that have been because all the independents resulting in that player’s death declared war on me?

    cause thats bogus. I was already at war with those cities when they were still owned by the AI.

    #119474

    Athei
    Member

    Might that have been because all the independents resulting in that player’s death declared war on me?

    Yup that’s the bug, and it’s most certainly because of the indies, Ai must be confused where to apply that -300 or -400 modifier because indies have no leader, so he just sticks it to you, even though you are not the one who declared war…

    #119475

    Ravenholme
    Member

    Also that Bolmor guy better be getting included as a stock leader because that is a fabulous dwarf.

    “I am Welcomed in the Home of Ravens and Other Scavengers in the Wake of Warriors, I am Friend to Carrion Crows and Wolves, I am Carry Me, and Kill with Me, and Die with Me Where the Road Ends; I am not the Honeyed Promise of Length of Life in Years to Come, I am the Iron Promise of Never Being a Slave.”

    #119491

    vota dc
    Member

    Interesting, they use a percentage to decide to which player surrender in case AI has lost more cities to different players?

    #119498

    Smaug3
    Member

    Quick question. Can you surrender to other players if you want to survive but are unable to fight? Cause I’d rather be a vassal than a dead hero.

    Something witty.

    #119514

    Gloweye
    Member

    Better a Living Coward than a Dead Hero?

    You ever read Terry Pratchett?

    I don’t think so. It would require something a bit more complicated than AI surrendering to you. maybe something could be done like Alpha Centauri’s Pact to serve you…(I.E., you stay as another faction, but at that moment, you give up all your money and techs, and you are put in an alliance you cannot break. Also, in the planetary council(Kinda UN-like), your vote is under his control).

    #119515

    Thariorn
    Member

    Quick question. Can you surrender to other players if you want to survive but are unable to fight? Cause I’d rather be a vassal than a dead hero.

    I’m actually not sure, but IF you can, you’d still lose the game.
    Your victor would just have you (And your tropps + ‘greatest’ settlement) in his Empire further increase his chance to win.

    No Mod, but I try to help - Bane of Cockatrice, a Star and an Onion.

    #119526

    Ericridge
    Member

    Better a Living Coward than a Dead Hero?

    You ever read Terry Pratchett?

    I don’t think so. It would require something a bit more complicated than AI surrendering to you. maybe something could be done like Alpha Centauri’s Pact to serve you…(I.E., you stay as another faction, but at that moment, you give up all your money and techs, and you are put in an alliance you cannot break. Also, in the planetary council(Kinda UN-like), your vote is under his control).

    I played Civ 4, a vassal could choose to break away from it’s master whenever it’s strength reached a certain point, % of the master’s strength if I remember correctly. However the Master is free to dow on you again to bring you under his control again. I never had it happen to me because AIs weren’t simply good enough.

    #119539

    Althea
    Member

    Back to topic. I want ask something, is alliance issue with AI already being addressed?

    Because right now, AI accept alliance too easily, i never say them decline any alliance offer.

    Also, i notice in this game, when you’re ally with someone else, when one member of the alliance is declared war by someone, the other member of the alliance doesn’t instantly enter into the same war. Is this intended or just a bug?

    Regarding that, maybe a defensive pact option like in Civ series can add more flavor to diplomacy.

    #119543

    MartyD81
    Member

    Finally, improvements to the diplomacy system! I only hope these changes are not cosmetic because the whole system as of now really screams for a substantial overhaul. The changes outlined in the dev. journal sound good, especially the AI being able to surrender – that will surely improve the game-flow. I also like an emphasis on the AI behaviour within the diplomacy system, the AI really needs to assess its options far more reasonably (and it is not only infamous tresspasing as it likes…). I just wish there were more diplomatic options as such – what about time-limited non-aggression pacts, making allies make peace/alliances with other factions, a time-limited truce option, global commercial (resource) agreements etc. I also hope neutral cities get some attention as well to make them a more interesting faction to deal with diplomatically. Let’s see what the devs can come up with next – the changes look promising so far.

    #119545

    wenitaseris
    Member

    will be anligment system also adres in your new dlc? or at least in some up coming patch following the release of golden realms?^^

    #119549

    JPoll
    Member

    This is one of the dev journals I have been looking forward to the most. Sounds like this will immensely improve gameplay in general. I hope that the AIs decisions become more logical and comprehensible with this patch.

    #119554

    Ravenholme
    Member

    This is one of the dev journals I have been looking forward to the most. Sounds like this will immensely improve gameplay in general. I hope that the AIs decisions become more logical and comprehensible with this patch.

    If not this one, then we’ve still got a promise of continuing improvements to the AI from this dev log.

    “I am Welcomed in the Home of Ravens and Other Scavengers in the Wake of Warriors, I am Friend to Carrion Crows and Wolves, I am Carry Me, and Kill with Me, and Die with Me Where the Road Ends; I am not the Honeyed Promise of Length of Life in Years to Come, I am the Iron Promise of Never Being a Slave.”

    #119560

    Leyrann
    Member

    Back to topic. I want ask something, is alliance issue with AI already being addressed?

    Because right now, AI accept alliance too easily, i never say them decline any alliance offer.

    Also, i notice in this game, when you’re ally with someone else, when one member of the alliance is declared war by someone, the other member of the alliance doesn’t instantly enter into the same war. Is this intended or just a bug?

    Regarding that, maybe a defensive pact option like in Civ series can add more flavor to diplomacy.

    Accepting an alliance: This might just be because you’re always the stronger factor. Because if an empire stronger than yours asks you to form an alliance, why would you reject?

    Alliance/Peace/War: That’s just how AoW has always worked. Relations are specific to every other player. The difference between an Alliance and Peace is that with an Alliance you can win together with allied victory, and you can see what the other is doing. I suppose that in FFA PvP it also shows more trust that simple peace.

    #119578

    Dohlenmann
    Member

    will be anligment system also adres in your new dlc? or at least in some up coming patch following the release of golden realms?^^

    In addition to this, I wonder if the campaign scenarios also have some “open” diplomacy involved. As you know in most campaign missions these alliances are mostly fixed, because story wise it makes no sense in any other way. But I wonder if there will be missions where there are leaders who are a bit of wild card. It should be able to fight them or form an alliance, just as you like.

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