Areal strategic spells

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Home Forums Age of Wonders 3 Discussions Areal strategic spells

This topic contains 20 replies, has 10 voices, and was last updated by  b0rsuk 5 years, 1 month ago.

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  • #100327

    Taykor
    Member

    Thing is there are very little of them in the game now.

    And I think it is a shortcoming of the game. No fantasy TBS game with many strategic spells is complete without areal strategic spells.
    (Ok, there are Freeze Water and Cleanse Land, but it is not nearly enough)

    Of course, the first thing which comes to mind is damage spells. Sadly, Lightning Storm is one target only. And Sun Burst, and holy strike. So naturally it would be nice to expand area of effect of some of them, or add new damage spell affecting at least 7 hexes. But pure damage spells could be a bit bland.

    So, I’d like spells that have great range (2 hexes min (19 hexes area) , 3 hexes preferably (37 hexes area)) and some duration (2-3 turns).
    For example they could:
    – decrease speed of passing armies, two possible (I think) realizations:
    # temporarily increase movement cost of hexes
    # applying debuff on all passing armies (extreme case: webs)
    – decrease vision range of passing armies
    – apply various debuffs (like poison vines)
    – banish (trying) summoned creatures
    – damage units of specific class (undead for example)
    – apply “fast healing” (more like instant spell)
    – dispel all bebuffs
    – summon neutral units
    – heal
    – put all units inside in stasis (no regen, move, spells, combat allowed)
    – reposition units in area

    Of course, nice graphic effects would be welcome. But not crucial.

    For example, I proposed

    Storm of the Century
    Affects all hexes in radius 3 on the strategic map (19 hexes) for 3 turns, each affected hex costs 4 more movement points, each party in the area suffers 5 phys 5 shock damage.

    Something analogous could be thought up with Raging Blizzard which reduces sight by 4 hexes for example and causes cold damage.
    Both do not stack (you can’t cast another one on the hexes already affected.

    So, what are your suggestions? Which areal strategic spells you want to see in the game?

    #100352

    Sunicle
    Member

    I believe I get your thinking. Although for me it don’t need to be spells. It may be traps as well, or bombs thrown on certain tiles.
    I’m thinking about what’s going on in a game like Expeditions: Conquistador. Units can, once they’ve acquired the ability, perform these special actions within a range of where they are.

    In AoW III there is some spell of which I forgot the exact name, but it lets tentacles grow out of the ground which impede the movement of any walking unit with 50%. But it affects the whole battlefield, which is too crude for my liking, and too powerful if fighting melee units with ranged units. I would like a spell like that to only affect an area, and perhaps also only have a temporary effect.

    Either with spells of with physically implemented things I think the game can do more with affecting areas in tactical combat, yes.

    #100358

    I would like these if they were part of an expanding of the spheres now, so you can go beyond ‘mastery’ and have grand mastery, and if you could mix spheres to unlock new spells. So being an Air GrandMaster and a Water master unlocks Blizzard (3 air, 2 water) once certain spells have been unlocked (e.g. Great Hail).

    I envision a reworking of the specialisations to allow 5 picks in total, with more spells and skills in each category, and also a new category related to ‘alchemy’ which allows resource exchanging (i.e. mana to gold and vice versa) and has economic boosts (as we have explorer boosts, population boosts, why not economy specialisations?).

    I’d also love for the magic to be antagonistic like it was in Aow1, by which I mean picking Air excluded Earth, so you were very unlikely to be able to use both stone skin and seeker (mind you, stone skin then was proportionally much stronger, giving + 2 defence when the max was 10, so in AoW3 turns it’d be + 5 or + 6 defence to give you an idea of how valuable it was).

    #100399

    Taykor
    Member

    I believe I get your thinking.

    I’m afraid, not. I was talking about spells on strategic map exclusively. There is no critical shortage of areal and multi-target spells in battle (though special stress is indeed laid on single target damage spells).

    I would like these if they were part of an expanding of the spheres now, so you can go beyond ‘mastery’ and have grand mastery, and if you could mix spheres to unlock new spells.

    I’d like such spells included in current spheres, something like 1 spell per element (I guess they would go to masteries then), and some classes could get one. Of course, more would be better, but this would be good already (considering an amount of work; though I guess this would be mainly graphical and design work, most technical elements of areal spells are already in the game: freeze water, poison vines, webs, domain enchantments, terraforming).

    So being an Air GrandMaster and a Water master unlocks Blizzard (3 air, 2 water) once certain spells have been unlocked (e.g. Great Hail).

    I suppose that would push such spells to extremely late game, and I want them much more common occasion.

    I envision a reworking of the specialisations to allow 5 picks in total

    4 or 5 would be nice, yes.

    I’d also love for the magic to be antagonistic like it was in Aow1,

    I’m not sure. It would drastically lessen number of combinations, and contradict a little with increasing a number of specialisation picks.

    #100400

    Garresh
    Member

    How about the mist spell from shadow magic? 7 hexes that conceal everyone inside. great for tricksters.

    #100404

    Taykor
    Member

    How about the mist spell from shadow magic? 7 hexes that conceal everyone inside. great for tricksters.

    Very nice, actually. I forgot about something like that. But the mist is itself visible?

    #100425

    Taykor
    Member

    Concerning concealment, there’s another idea for area strategic spells:
    – true sight
    – revealing of fog of war

    #100510

    Taykor
    Member

    Other thoughts, suggestions?

    #100550

    Zorn
    Member

    I think it would be enough to increase the range of city enchantments. E.g. poison domain. Its only useful, if your opponent is looming around that city for several turns, which just doesnt happen. They either conquer it on the second turn after they entered the domain at the latest, or withdraw.
    And even if not, I have not seen it happening that the same city is at the frontlines for a long time. So area enchantments that only affect the domain of a single city are never worth it. If it would afect your whole empire, AOW 2 style, things would be different.

    #100567

    Taykor
    Member

    Yes, it’s true. Even more useless is Summoner’s Aura. At first I thought that it was a global spell, but then it turned out it was a city enchantment which made it pointless: buff to your summons is needed most when outside of your domains or even inside enemy domain. Even considering it a defensive enchantment its anchoring to a single town makes it terribly inconvenient.

    But that is not the topic here. Areal spells could be cast anywhere and have much less area and a limited working period comparing to city enchantments. It’s a completely different thing.

    #100654

    Taykor
    Member

    Another thing strategic area spells could do is interaction with strategic map structures.
    For example, an area spell could destroy roads (which would be very nice against advancing land forces, especially with ‘advanced logistics’).

    #103206

    Fluks
    Member

    I agree, more spells on the strategic map would be great! Especially smaller, temporarily effects (like un/holy woods in AOW2 and poison plants), a city-cloaking spell would be neat too!
    And i really wish the terraformer spell could be buffed, so it can be cast like summons next to your heroes.

    #103210

    esvath
    Member

    Yeah, instead of city-based, Strategic spells should affect all territory. Increase the casting cost/CP and upkeep, if needed for balance reasons, but make them global please.

    #103219

    terrahero
    Member

    Age of Wonders has a history of such spells. Cursed/Blessed woods, poison brambles, various Nova. But also huge global spells like Flood. And i kinda miss things like Crusade.

    #103276

    b0rsuk
    Member

    Earth magic could contain Build Fortress spell, which builds Stone Wall in target city or Stone Fortress if cast outside your domain. Specializations lack spells like this – distinctive, interesting, thematic.

    #103358

    Leon Feargus
    Member

    So, what are your suggestions? Which areal strategic spells you want to see in the game?

    Oldies:
    – Raise/flatten mountains
    – Tornado
    Newies:
    – Stimuli (boost of morale for units on target hexes)
    – Horrific Illusions (makes enemy armies scatter)

    I envision a reworking of the specialisations to allow 5 picks in total, with more spells and skills in each category

    I remember you proposed this before and I heartily agree again!

    I’d also love for the magic to be antagonistic like it was in Aow1, by which I mean picking Air excluded Earth

    I didn’t like this in aow1 and thus vote against it.

    Yes, it’s true. Even more useless is Summoner’s Aura. At first I thought that it was a global spell, but then it turned out it was a city enchantment which made it pointless: buff to your summons is needed most when outside of your domains or even inside enemy domain. Even considering it a defensive enchantment its anchoring to a single town makes it terribly inconvenient.

    I agree with this, I never use Summoner’s Aura. It should be an offensive spell (Sorceror has none) to target enemy cities.

    #103406

    Taykor
    Member

    offensive spell (Sorceror has none) to target enemy cities.

    Actually, Sorcerer has one pretty powerful city debuff – Dread Omen.

    #103413

    Leon Feargus
    Member

    <div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Leon Feargus wrote:</div>
    offensive spell (Sorceror has none) to target enemy cities.

    Actually, Sorcerer has one pretty powerful city debuff – Dread Omen.

    ah yeah, slipped my mind there…

    #103415

    Fluks
    Member

    Oldies:<br>
    – Raise/flatten mountains<br>
    – Tornado<br>
    Newies:<br>
    – Stimuli (boost of morale for units on target hexes)<br>
    – Horrific Illusions (makes enemy armies scatter)

    +1 to all of that 🙂 maybe the raise flattened mountains could be worked into an reworked terraforming, like making it a research chain like:
    Terraformer 1: As is
    Terraformer 2: Can be applied outside of your domain on adjacent hexes to your units, plus possibility to change and make watertiles.
    Terraformer 3: raise/flatten mountains.

    Instead of terraformer 1-3 maybe they could be called “Terraformer”, “Irrigation” and “Mountain works”.

    I envision a reworking of the specialisations to allow 5 picks in total, with more spells and skills in each category, and also a new category related to ‘alchemy’ which allows resource exchanging (i.e. mana to gold and vice versa) and has economic boosts (as we have explorer boosts, population boosts, why not economy specialisations?).

    +1 to that, especially the alchemist thing, but maybe alchemist could be one of the new classes like sorcerer or so, but an economy pick yes please.
    Since it is possible to mingle and mix every race already i don’t like the idea of making earth/air, water/fire etc. strictly antagonistic. But if thats a price to pay for introducing a 5 pick system ok for me…

    #103418

    Fluks
    Member

    So, what are your suggestions? Which areal strategic spells you want to see in the game?

    A city cloaking spell at least for the rogue class.

    And i think especially the spheres of influence should be somewhat modifiable by spells/building so:

    A building that enables turning your sphere on and off for a city. Or enable it for all cities as soon as you build the tier3 class specific building.

    A spell that “dispells” the sphere of an enemy off one of his cities for x turns.

    A “parasite” spell that lets you cast spells in your enemies sphere of influence as if it was yours.

    A spy curse that lets you see what the cursed unit sees on the strategic map.

    #103421

    b0rsuk
    Member

    I think rogues would be more amusing if you could pretend your armies/cities are neutral. Imagine surprise of a player who’s attacked by a “neutral” nearby city!

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