Shadow Realm – campaign

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Home Forums Modding and Map Making Shadow Realm – campaign

This topic contains 213 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by  Refineus 2 months ago.

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  • #258246

    Hiliadan
    Member

    Have you looked here? Dropbox (AOW III content)\AoW3-Shadow-Realm-expansion\pics)

    Ok, didn’t expect them here (but that’s indeed the right place for them, though we can probably create a sub-folder). Now I found them. I’ll comment on them later, now I need to tackle other priorities (finishing the structures for the expansion + v1.23 of the balance mod).

    I’m not the best writer compiling story in mission briefing and description and such. I can work from things provided here and from the wikia. However, telling story inside game is not my strongest point. I set up an XLM document with all necessary information regarding how the story can be written what each row actually perform inside game.

    I think the best placed for this would be Draxynnic.

    Also, I can create heroes and premade leaders for shadowelfs as said before in mod

    Yes, please do, will be very useful. Please report them here so that I can add them to the Wikia.

    By the way, did you modify stuff in the .acp, like adding scripts for structures? I got errors in the log in the alpha test PBEM game, I asked Gloweye and we are not sure where it came from. The scripts should be on the maps directly and not on the .acp

    #258251

    Refineus
    Member

    Yes, please do, will be very useful. Please report them here so that I can add them to the Wikia.

    By the way, did you modify stuff in the .acp, like adding scripts for structures? I got errors in the log in the alpha test PBEM game, I asked Gloweye and we are not sure where it came from. The scripts should be on the maps directly and not on the .acp

    I have not. The reason being I do not want to touch mod all that much regarding moding and scripting.

    The ones I would touch would be RPK, regardin leaders and heroes. If scripting somehow interferes from Excel documents for stories and such I do not believe. The only thing so far is actually Campaign ACP which should not affect something at all.

    #258323

    Refineus
    Member

    We have now nine pre-made leaders and 7 heroes. All modded and in-game working.

    Sydran of Shading Winds, Male Arch Druid
    Arachna the Spider Queen, Female Rough
    Meandor Arvana, Male Necromancer
    Luna Stargazer, Female Arch Druid
    Bowan Stargazer, Male Sorceress
    Postia Ira Kror, Female Warlord
    Crador Ulora, Male Dreadnought
    Morrandir the Warrior Priest, Male Theocrat
    Unoras Tasklor, Male Theocrat

    Anstrophia Ralian, Female Sorceress
    Retrymoria the Shadow Star, Female Dreadnought
    Sephyra Devion, Female Necro
    Tvirux Sandre Cor, Female Theocrat
    Thieralies Av Gylon, Male Warlock
    Kyridarion Yaranger, Male Rouge
    Centro Vyrodor, Male Arch Druid

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    #258325

    Hiliadan
    Member

    If scripting somehow interferes from Excel documents for stories and such I do not believe. The only thing so far is actually Campaign ACP which should not affect something at all.

    Not sure what you mean here? .acd maybe? Because we should not have a separate .acp (mod file) for the campaign, right?

    I think we actually need 2 Leaders (1 male, 1 female) AND 2 heroes (1 male, 1 female) for each class/race, right? Because the Leaders like Julia, Merlin, etc. are custom Leaders but do not appear as heroes. Or am I missing something (I never use custom Leaders so I’m not so familiar with the ones who are there)?
    I feel like Arachna should not be a recruitable hero or a playable Leader for that matter. Lore-wise, she should not be on our world, right?
    For the Leaders, could you please list their specs?
    Might also be good to add a bit more info on each of them like where they appear in the campaign, their character, etc.
    I’ll list everything here: http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Hiliadan/Shadow_Realm_Community_Expansion#Heroes_.2F_leaders

    (by the way, it’s Rogue, not Rouge :P)

    #258328

    Refineus
    Member

    Refineus wrote:
    If scripting somehow interferes from Excel documents for stories and such I do not believe. The only thing so far is actually Campaign ACP which should not affect something at all.
    Not sure what you mean here? .acd maybe? Because we should not have a separate .acp (mod file) for the campaign, right?

    Yeah .Acd So far only Excel documents have been added by me so I do not think it should conflict.

    I think we actually need 2 Leaders (1 male, 1 female) AND 2 heroes (1 male, 1 female) for each class/race, right? Because the Leaders like Julia, Merlin, etc. are custom Leaders but do not appear as heroes. Or am I missing something (I never use custom Leaders so I’m not so familiar with the ones who are there)?
    I feel like Arachna should not be a recruitable hero or a playable Leader for that matter. Lore-wise, she should not be on our world, right?
    For the Leaders, could you please list their specs?
    Might also be good to add a bit more info on each of them like where they appear in the campaign, their character, etc.
    I’ll list everything here: http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Hiliadan/Shadow_Realm_Community_Expansion#Heroes_.2F_leaders

    (by the way, it’s Rogue, not Rouge :P)

    Rough Rouge…

    Arachna is the one I have not been particularly sure of. She can be replaced.

    Regarding Male/female balance on both heroes and leader roster, it can be balanced. However, not all races in Aow III have a perfect balance. Draconians, Tigrans and Frostling do not have this kind of balance.

    Spec: like inventory, stats or specializations?

    • This reply was modified 11 months, 2 weeks ago by  Refineus.
    • This reply was modified 11 months, 2 weeks ago by  Refineus.
    #258331

    HousePet
    Member

    Specs would be Specializations for the Leaders and maybe starting stat mods for Heroes.

    #258332

    Draxynnic
    Member

    Yeah, I’d probably leave Arachne out unless we actually plan to use her in the campaign (which at the moment I don’t believe we are…). If she is incorporated, I’d be inclined to make her an archdruid rather than a rogue. The Queen of Spiders should be able to summon spiders, after all.

    My understanding is that leaders and heroes are generally different pools. The reason why some heroes come up as leaders in vanilla is because some heroes were also added to the leader pool in order to provide a full range of race/class combinations.

    #258333

    Refineus
    Member

    Yeah, I’d probably leave Arachne out unless we actually plan to use her in the campaign (which at the moment I don’t believe we are…). If she is incorporated, I’d be inclined to make her an archdruid rather than a rogue. The Queen of Spiders should be able to summon spiders, after all.

    My understanding is that leaders and heroes are generally different pools. The reason why some heroes come up as leaders in vanilla is because some heroes were also added to the leader pool in order to provide a full range of race/class combinations.

    I just made her reading somewhere in the brainstorm of word Arachna. I think it’s okay to leave her out. It’s possible to ad “Laladria” from Aow: Shadow magic

    Description from Aow: Shadow magic

    “I may replace her with Hated by jealous Spider Queens for her exceptional beauty among the council of Dark elf priestesses, Laladria wanders the world in search of ways to prove herself to her people and to the creatures she serves in the shadows. Like venom from a spider, she uses her magic to weaken her prey, prior to slaying it. She is a bit more resistant to magic and toxins than her fellow priestesses, for the many times those who hated her attempted to poison her.”

    Also, the first mission can be played in the campaign. It was not before. But it’s much to do still like adding story elements, city placements and such. It’s a sort of pre-alpha-state. The campaign is working technically from the menu.

    Due to the fact, Shadow Elf leaders are sort of made. Sydran is considered the first Shadow Elf we meet in the campaign what my brain had worked out. And the bad Shadow Elf cooperating with Werlac can be Unoras.

    • This reply was modified 11 months, 2 weeks ago by  Refineus.
    • This reply was modified 11 months, 2 weeks ago by  Refineus.
    • This reply was modified 11 months, 2 weeks ago by  Refineus.
    #258338

    Gloweye
    Member

    Meandor Arvana, Male Necromancer

    Shouldn’t this be “Meandor of House Inioch”, like his sister Julia ?

    Dont know where that Arvana comes from.

    #258351

    Refineus
    Member

    Meandor Arvana, Male Necromancer

    Shouldn’t this be “Meandor of House Inioch”, like his sister Julia ?

    Dont know where that Arvana comes from.

    This names came from the other Dark Elf template race mod made by Arnout. I never really saw any connection with this “Arvana”. I give it a change.

    #258372

    Refineus
    Member

    I updated some names and such today and added a new leader to replace Arachna.

    I won’t have time to work this week so much on the campaign, the reason being I’m going to Latvia for the whole week and will have much more studies coming up later on.

    When time occurs I will proceed with the campaign.

    So far it looks like this

    Sydran of Shading Winds, Male Arch Druid: Peach keeper, Wild master
    Quondria Trondor, Female Rogue: Earth adept, Explorer, Grey guard
    Meandor of House Inioch, Male Necromancer: Earth master, Destruction
    Luna Stargazer, Female Arch Druid: Fire, Water, Partisan
    Bowan Stargazer, Male Sorceress: Air, Explorer, Wild
    Postia Ira Kror, Female Warlord: Water master, Expander
    Crador Ulora, Male Dreadnought: Air master, Destruction
    Morrandir the Warrior Priest, Male Theocrat: Destruction master, Shadowborn adept
    Unoras Tasklor, Male Theocrat: Creation, Partisan, Wild

    Anstrophia Ralian, Female Sorceress
    Retrymoria the Shadow Star, Female Dreadnought
    Sephyra Devion, Female Necro
    Tvirux Sandre Cor, Female Theocrat
    Thieralies Av Gylon, Male Warlock
    Kyridarion Yaranger, Male Rogue
    Centro Vyrodor, Male Arch Druid
    Izakara Nimalus, Female Rogue

    If someone has feedback or ideas, shoot away.

    • This reply was modified 11 months, 1 week ago by  Refineus.
    • This reply was modified 11 months, 1 week ago by  Refineus.
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    #258377

    lordoflinks
    Member

    So are the Dark Elves going to be involved in the Campaign?

    #258379

    Refineus
    Member

    So are the Dark Elves going to be involved in the Campaign?

    They will be featured in the third mission. Out of my calculation of including “step-by-step” from story point.

    #258392

    HousePet
    Member

    Peach Master is an apt specialisation for an Arch Druid 😀

    #258464

    Quaranyr
    Member

    Meandor of House Inioch, Male Necromancer: Earth master, Destruction

    Wouldn’t Destruction Master be more suiting for him? It has “Storm Magic”.

    #258676

    Hiliadan
    Member

    @draxynnic: BBB has some time and interest to help with testing in December. I was thinking maybe it would be interesting to test the 1st map of the campaign. I talked to Refineus and he says some stuff are already in place, though it’s still with classic victory conditions. Maybe you could have a look at it first, to help with this:

    I’m not the best writer compiling story in mission briefing and description and such. I can work from things provided here and from the wikia. However, telling story inside game is not my strongest point. I set up an XLM document with all necessary information regarding how the story can be written what each row actually perform inside game.

    I haven’t updated the info on the maps on the Wiki yet, still you can look at what was compiled before: http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Hiliadan/Shadow_Realm_Community_Expansion#Campaign

    If you’re not in free in December, no problem, we can probably let BBB join us in a new PBEM game to test random maps. 🙂

    • This reply was modified 10 months, 3 weeks ago by  Hiliadan.
    #258738

    Refineus
    Member

    There is progress on the first map. I will compile some scripting later when I got time for it. I will be in Lithuania for a couple of days next week and will see if can squeeze in some time for map making.

    However, a final thought on the first mission.

    It’s set in the ruins of Sunbirth mountain. Thematically it will be autumn/blighted and underground of a 98% copy of Melenis dungeon from Eternal lords.

    Players involved.
    Main leader: Julia of House Inioch
    Allies: Edward, Ham, Sundren
    Enemies: Carishar Morclaw and Vervlukt the foulmouthed.
    Possible: Sydran of Shading Wind (Shadow Elf) arrive at a later point in the mission.

    Still to decide. Change the Draconian, Carishar Morclaw sorceress into more evil counterpart as a necromancer with Shadowborn master skills.

    Peach Master is an apt specialisation for an Arch Druid

    I will take ideas into a consideration. Peace master can work. Sydran might change skills.
    Theirs is no final yet on leaders.

    Meandor of House Inioch, Male Necromancer: Earth master, Destruction

    Wouldn’t Destruction Master be more suiting for him? It has “Storm Magic”.

    I will look into it. Earth seems weird.

    • This reply was modified 10 months, 3 weeks ago by  Refineus.
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    #258741

    Hiliadan
    Member

    HousePet wrote:

    Peach Master is an apt specialisation for an Arch Druid

    I will take ideas into a consideration. Peace master can work. Sydran might change skills.
    Theirs is no final yet on leaders.

    This was a joke from HousePet because you mispelled “peace” the first time and it looked like “peach” and peach is a fruit… and AD, nature… so joke. 😛 No need to consider it.

    I will look into it. Earth seems weird.

    I would wait for Drax’ feedback here. I think it was him who said Earth Master and there was surely a reason for it. No need to change that in a haste.

    #258742

    Refineus
    Member

    This was a joke from HousePet because you mispelled “peace” the first time and it looked like “peach” and peach is a fruit… and AD, nature… so joke. No need to consider it.

    Hahaha, yeah now I see it 🙂

    I would wait for Drax’ feedback here. I think it was him who said Earth Master and there was surely a reason for it. No need to change that in a haste.

    No rush at all.

    #258786

    Draxynnic
    Member

    December’s actually looking pretty okay. Will need to actually get around to getting a Dropbox account set up and working, though. *’.’*

    It’s pretty late local tonight, though, so I’ll look into it tomorrow.

    In the meantime:

    Still to decide. Change the Draconian, Carishar Morclaw sorceress into more evil counterpart as a necromancer with Shadowborn master skills.

    It’s been a while, but didn’t Carishar get killed in Edward’s fourth mission? Edward’s campaign isn’t 100% canon, but I’d be hesitant to use Carishar regardless.

    If it is a necromancer, it’s probably worth putting in some indications that it’s a necromancer that predated Melenis (there were a few).

    As I’ve noted before, I’m hesitant about having big-name characters for the player in the first mission. We want Julia et al to be around, of course, but I think it’s worth having a relative newbie for the player so it’s believable that they can actually level the character up – Julia, Edward, Ham and Sundren should all realistically be level 15+ by this point.

    I would wait for Drax’ feedback here. I think it was him who said Earth Master and there was surely a reason for it. No need to change that in a haste.

    Meandor in Shadow Magic has a mix of Death and Earth spheres, which is what giving him Earth represents.

    Personally, I think there are arguments for both Destruction Master and Earth Master. Giving him Destruction Master is really mostly a matter of giving the founder of the Cult of Storms the Storm Magic research, and making him better with Destruction Nodes. Earth Mastery grants him enough earth magic to actually feel reminiscent of the Death/Earth split he had in Shadow Magic rather than simply dabbling in Earth.

    From a lore perspective, I think it’s a bit of a coin toss. Neither the Destruction Mastery nor the Earth Mastery really feel as if they’re vital to Meandor’s character. Giving him Destruction Master might risk making him too evil, though – I’m not sure the Meandor of Shadow Magic would be looking to blight the landscape, even if his undead servants aren’t bothered much by it.

    #258792

    Gloweye
    Member

    From a lore perspective, I think it’s a bit of a coin toss. Neither the Destruction Mastery nor the Earth Mastery really feel as if they’re vital to Meandor’s character. Giving him Destruction Master might risk making him too evil, though – I’m not sure the Meandor of Shadow Magic would be looking to blight the landscape, even if his undead servants aren’t bothered much by it.

    I’d say destruction master, than disable the empire spells on all campaign maps, so that he won’t do that. I think that fits better than earth.

    Alternatively, we could try to give him both at master level…. It won’t show in the UI, but he might have both available for research.

    #258810

    Draxynnic
    Member

    Righto, got Dropbox working.

    From a lore perspective, I think it’s a bit of a coin toss. Neither the Destruction Mastery nor the Earth Mastery really feel as if they’re vital to Meandor’s character. Giving him Destruction Master might risk making him too evil, though – I’m not sure the Meandor of Shadow Magic would be looking to blight the landscape, even if his undead servants aren’t bothered much by it.

    I’d say destruction master, than disable the empire spells on all campaign maps, so that he won’t do that. I think that fits better than earth.

    Alternatively, we could try to give him both at master level…. It won’t show in the UI, but he might have both available for research.

    For the purposes of campaign maps, another possibility is to just give him certain skills unlocked by default, similar to how the second mission in the Eternal Lords campaign starts with Arctic Empire and related spells unlocked.

    Such tweaking would certainly work for the campaign, but I think it is worth considering the effects on his behaviour in random scenarios as well. There is also an element that unless the player is playing as or fighting against Meandor, it’s unlikely that they’ll notice that Meandor has Destruction Master skills unless he does use Blighted Empire. Conversely, if he’s using City Quake and Earth Elemental, these might be noticed.

    Still, I don’t think it’s a big deal either way. Reformed Meandor is probably still antiheroic enough that he’d have no qualms about blighting the land if there’s a strategic advantage to doing so. He might plan to get in a Creation user to clean up afterwards, but he probably would be willing to do it.

    #258826

    Hiliadan
    Member

    Righto, got Dropbox working.

    Great! 🙂 You have a .taf I exported recently that you can use to test the 1st scenario of the campaign, it’s there: \Dropbox\AoW3-Shadow-Realm-expansion\mods\Exported Mod Files

    It’s SHADOW REALM.taf
    Put it in your UserContent, then when you launch (you will need Decodence, etc.), you should see the campaign in the Community Content tab in the Campaign section.

    I think Refineus mostly completed the skeleton of the 1st scenario and is working on the 2nd one so if you are inspired to write dialogues, etc. we could finish the 1st and maybe 2nd scenario in December. 🙂

    #258841

    Draxynnic
    Member

    Hrrrmn. Dropbox is working on my computer, but I haven’t been able to get access to the Shadow Realm stuff. Could be just that I don’t have enough experience with Dropbox to get everything connected, or it could be that I haven’t been able to chase up the appropriate details.

    Send me a message on Steam for anything that shouldn’t be discussed on a public forum!

    #258864

    Draxynnic
    Member

    Righto! The launcher gave me a couple of errors while compiling the Shadow Realm taf, but it seems to have sorted itself out.

    As requested by Hiliadan, I started by running with the minimum number of mods enabled – namely, Decodence and the Shadow Realm mod – in order to test to see if the campaign works without the Shadow Realm RMG taf file. It appears to be working as intended!

    Will take a little bit of time to explore the map as it currently stands, and then report back with my thoughts in a day or so!

    #258878

    Refineus
    Member

    It’s been a while, but didn’t Carishar get killed in Edward’s fourth mission? Edward’s campaign isn’t 100% canon, but I’d be hesitant to use Carishar regardless.

    If it is a necromancer, it’s probably worth putting in some indications that it’s a necromancer that predated Melenis (there were a few).

    As I’ve noted before, I’m hesitant about having big-name characters for the player in the first mission. We want Julia et al to be around, of course, but I think it’s worth having a relative newbie for the player so it’s believable that they can actually level the character up – Julia, Edward, Ham and Sundren should all realistically be level 15+ by this point.

    I think it’s possible he “might” have died. As usual when stories are kind of not canon with Edward, I gave this a thought that Vervlukt where a little too alone facing a team of four. However a.i can be restricted to just, stay home defending their territory, so Julia can do her business. It can also be an option to have a small quest to inspect each ally to gain a minion or hero.

    Righto! The launcher gave me a couple of errors while compiling the Shadow Realm taf, but it seems to have sorted itself out.

    As requested by Hiliadan, I started by running with the minimum number of mods enabled – namely, Decodence and the Shadow Realm mod – in order to test to see if the campaign works without the Shadow Realm RMG taf file. It appears to be working as intended!

    Will take a little bit of time to explore the map as it currently stands, and then report back with my thoughts in a day or so!

    It’s great that you have started to look at maps. (Map I rather say)

    I’m not quite sure if I have time to do things in December on progressing on the maps with triggers and scripting. If you have ideas on story dialoguing in-game, pages or other things, give me a heads up, write something in excel for the campaign or compile something in the changelog text file in campaign folder.

    Christmas and New years eve are coming up and I have to finish the last examining studies on two remaining courses to be able to allocate time for Aow III things. Also, I will be unavailable for almost 1.5 weeks now.

    I think Refineus mostly completed the skeleton of the 1st scenario and is working on the 2nd one so if you are inspired to write dialogues, etc. we could finish the 1st and maybe 2nd scenario in December.

    I can agree on some things. I would rather look for January probably. Too many things going on in December.

    #258879

    Draxynnic
    Member

    Righto – if December’s not going to work for you, then that will give me a bit more time to play around with it, and go back to my old save files of the original campaign and see if I can verify if Carishar is explicitly killed in Commonwealth 4.

    I’ve got a few nascent dialogue/monologue ideas running through my head, but we should probably finalise just what’s going to be on the map before I flesh those out too far. That discussion can wait until I’ve had a good look at what’s already there, though!

    #259070

    Draxynnic
    Member

    Ugh. I was not expecting to have such low energy this week…

    Weirdly, while I could START the map just fine, it turns out that loading saves on the map requires having Gloweye’s Dark Elf Dwelling package loaded. So my initial try at seeing how the early stages of the map played out didn’t work so well, leading to having a look at the map construction instead.

    (I don’t suppose it’s possible to move the dungeon a few hexes west in order to deal with the cutoff on the side?)

    Looking over the map and the existing dialogue, it seems that the idea is that the entrances to Werlac’s area that were used at the end of Eternal Lords have been sealed up, and the player’s mission (to begin with, anyway) is to find an alternate route in from another location. This is something that I can definitely work with.

    Conveniently, this also allows us to remove many of the ‘big names’ from the picture. We can remove the halflings from the picture entirely and go with only one or two allies to begin with, opening up more potential to have additional enemy leaders or allied leaders that show up later in the scenario. I still like the idea of going with a draconian protagonist (on the basis of ‘someone who has native Shadow Walking’), so we could have a draconian contingent present as a contingency against the possibility of needing to enter the Shadow Realm, and just one starting ally representing the commander of the local (probably Commonwealth) forces in the vicinity.

    From previous discussion, having Julia as the leader was based on the idea that Julia’s presence would have an impact on Meandor. Thinking on this, I think it’s possible that Sundren might actually have a bigger impact – being the daughter of Julia and Sundren and, to an extent, a living symbol of the Mending. Sundren’s also become something of an intelligence specialist, so if there are multiple Torchbearer operations seeking to get into where the Shadow Portal is, it’d make sense that once one of those operations (namely, the player character) makes a breakthrough, Sundren would likely be the first to respond and bring reinforcements. We can use this to bring Sundren onto the field when she’s needed, without having a friendly level 20+ hero on the map right from the beginning.

    If people are happy with that general approach, I could probably take a shot at writing opening journal entries for the scenario. In-scenario dialogue might require working out a few more details, though.

    (I might also spawn a new file for the map in order to experiment with a few tweaks of my own. I haven’t played with the editor enough to set up triggers and such, but I can probably adjust the leaders and settlements on my own as well as fleshing out some of the currently less developed areas of the map.)

    #259079

    Hiliadan
    Member

    Weirdly, while I could START the map just fine, it turns out that loading saves on the map requires having Gloweye’s Dark Elf Dwelling package loaded.

    Weird indeed that you can start but not load. But the fact the DE Dwelling is required is probably a remnant of the inclusion of the DE. To clean up then.

    Mmh, what you describe seems to be the 2nd scenario described here: http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Hiliadan/Shadow_Realm_Community_Expansion#2nd_scenario_-_Through_the_Shadow_Gate

    Would probably be good to still have a 1st scenario before that, which can serve as an intro to the expansion, to give indications to players about when and where we are compared to the previous campaigns, what are the main forces in presence, etc.

    The content of most previous messages has not been used to update the Wiki so the Wiki is far from up to date, but would be good to start updating it now.
    So can we confirm the protagonists and story (the text in “Details”) of scenario #2?

    #259081

    Gloweye
    Member

    IMO, first map should start right off with you entering the shadow realm. It’s fine if you have to run around a bit to get there, tho. You could for example have Sundren show up when you find the shadow gate, and have her drawn away for other responsibilities for map two, as long as you warn it in advance.

    This might give you an intro to where we are in the story, but should definitely have a lot of SR involved. When you get to the gate, I think you should get like 2/3 draconian settlers in order to build a few outposts inside – like forward defense posts. Then offer up at least one ruined city so you can start that a bit bigger. Heck, we could make that your first city option, that you’re cityless at first. Just spouting random options here.

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