Starting Armies

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Home Forums Age of Wonders 3 Discussions Starting Armies

This topic contains 12 replies, has 8 voices, and was last updated by  D00m 5 years, 2 months ago.

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  • #100451

    D00m
    Member

    I’m not a fan of how starting armies are assigned. The major problem I have is the fact that Goblins which are already weak are treated poorly, while dwarves, which are strong to begin with, gain an additional advantage. Goblin units are 10% cheaper, while dwarf units are 10% more expensive, yet the cost is not taken into account when assigning units. If I’m wrong about this please correct me.

    I’d love to see starting armies being of roughly equal gold and/or mana value. That would give a small buff to goblins who struggle at the start and a small nerf to dwarves who imo are the strongest at fighting independents at the start (all observations based on medium army start).

    I’d also love it, if there was no chance of getting a T3 units with the medium starting army setting. That Firstborn on Theocrat is going gold for sure… well, most T3s will survive till gold, if played correctly with Theocrat. Of course the problem is not limited to Firstborn and/or Theocrat, I just mentioned what I consider the most striking/obvious example of the advantage such start grants to a player.

    #100611

    D00m
    Member

    I have a history with duplicating threads. 🙂 Is there one like this already? I recall Garresh saying something similar, but I think it was as part of a thread not dedicated to this specific topic, thus likely hard to find.

    #100651

    Garresh
    Member

    Agreed on all counts. Oh and doom youll be amused to know Ive stopped playing goblins outside of dread. Ive just accepted that theyre UP and that all the times Ive won with them were due to me avoiding military engagements entirely. Anything they can do other races can do better. Its sad though because they are fun.

    #100672

    Kozzie
    Member

    actually i recived yesterday a firstborn with normal army strenght….

    idk if it bugged but the firstborn was there

    first time ever i recived a t3 on those settings – probably bcs the firstborn is an infantry unit (not cav or flier like other races)

    #100673

    Stigrs77
    Member

    I sometimes get t3 units om Normal too, but usually I don’t.

    Agree with the OP, Goblins should get 9 units on Normal, not 8. Dwarves should have a lower chance of multiple T2 or a T3 unit in the starting army.

    #100698

    b0rsuk
    Member

    Goblins are 10% cheaper. So, logically, you would be able to muster another 1 unit per 10 units of starting army. The default starting army is what, 6 units + Leader + hero you can recruit ? So should goblins gain extra 0.6 of a unit ?

    Likewise with Dwarves. They would get 0.6 units fewer.

    While Goblins and Dwarves differ in production costs, upkeep remains the same. So in long term dwarves are the best. Not that many goblin units have Volunteer – for example Untouchables don’t seem to get the perk, and none of the class units get it.

    #100732

    Garresh
    Member

    Also while goblin class units are extremely good, goblin racial units seem in my opinion to be largely outclassed. Their warg riders have good utility with overwhelm and forestry and wetland walking. And swarm darters are awesome, but their sheer squishiness as a factor of cost is crippling for most units. I think an additional 10% price cut on most racial goblin units might bring them in line, or production overflow.

    #100734

    D00m
    Member

    actually i recived yesterday a firstborn with normal army strenght….

    idk if it bugged but the firstborn was there

    first time ever i recived a t3 on those settings – probably bcs the firstborn is an infantry unit (not cav or flier like other races)

    Medium army strength has a small chance of giving you a T3 unit usually accompanied by 5 irregulars. If you’d like to find out what’s the exact percentage chance I suggest you ask Gabbek… he knows 🙂

    #100735

    D00m
    Member

    @garresh
    I quite like the whole idea of production (and knowledge) overflow. Is there a separate thread about it already?

    #100738

    Bob5
    Member

    @garresh<br>
    I quite like the whole idea of production (and knowledge) overflow. Is there a separate thread about it already?

    Only one I can find is this one:

    http://ageofwonders.com/forums/topic/production/

    It’s an old one though. The idea has also been mentioned quite a few times in other threads not specifically dedicated to production overflow, like this one

    http://ageofwonders.com/forums/topic/making-races-matter-goblin-love/

    #100772

    SetaX
    Member

    I’m not a fan of how starting armies are assigned. The major problem I have is the fact that Goblins which are already weak are treated poorly, while dwarves, which are strong to begin with, gain an additional advantage. Goblin units are 10% cheaper, while dwarf units are 10% more expensive, yet the cost is not taken into account when assigning units. If I’m wrong about this please correct me.

    I’d love to see starting armies being of roughly equal gold and/or mana value. That would give a small buff to goblins who struggle at the start and a small nerf to dwarves who imo are the strongest at fighting independents at the start (all observations based on medium army start).

    I’d also love it, if there was no chance of getting a T3 units with the medium starting army setting. That Firstborn on Theocrat is going gold for sure… well, most T3s will survive till gold, if played correctly with Theocrat. Of course the problem is not limited to Firstborn and/or Theocrat, I just mentioned what I consider the most striking/obvious example of the advantage such start grants to a player.

    I agree completely. Me and my friend have the same problem. If you get a T3 at start you will have a HUGE advantage over the others,especially in MP matches. Noone should get it IMHO. Pls balance the starting armies.
    Regarding the goblins,I just dont play them at all. 🙁 As you guys said they are too vulnerable. I like the way they feel,I like the concept,their world but something is missing. Fine,they are cheaper but it doesn’t make a difference if they die soo quickly and easily and I have to reproduce them all the time,so at the end they are more expensive than others. Not to mention I could use that production time for something else than nonstop build those units. 🙁

    #100833

    NuMetal
    Member

    If you get a T3 at start you will have a HUGE advantage over the others,especially in MP matches. Noone should get it IMHO. Pls balance the starting armies.

    I do agree that the starting armies should be balanced, but I don’t think that this makes removing Tier3s in them necessary. Having Tier3s in starting armies would still be ok if it were so that either all or no players had them.

    Besides that I fully agree that Goblins should get a unit more than the other races at the beginning or something different to make up for their weakness.

    #100878

    D00m
    Member

    I do agree that the starting armies should be balanced, but I don’t think that this makes removing Tier3s in them necessary. Having Tier3s in starting armies would still be ok if it were so that either all or no players had them.

    I was talking specifically about medium starting army setting, I don’t mind the fact that you get T3s with strong starting army setting. And yes, I also think they should be standardized. For medium army I’d prefer no T3s for anyone.

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