How To beat Theocrats With Necromancers?

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Home Forums Age of Wonders 3 Discussions How To beat Theocrats With Necromancers?

This topic contains 14 replies, has 8 voices, and was last updated by  chrysophylax páuperem 6 years, 6 months ago.

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  • #236497

    I like Necromancers, I am just turned off by how weak they seem to be when facing Theocrats. In Multiplayer I am pretty sure that if I dared using them, the opponents would just pick Theocrat leaders and the game would end right there.

    Any suggestion?

    #236502

    Sartarius
    Member

    Id say that Necromancers can easily beat Theo and it is Theo who has hard time facing Necro. The only troubles Necro could have are shrines as they are machines.

    #236504

    Bob5
    Member

    Enemy of the Faith helps a lot. Desecration helps a lot. Power Ritual also helps a lot. And Bone Collectors also do decently with Spirit Protection and Demolisher. Disjunct the Great Purge as soon as the Theo activates it, as well as Armageddon.

    #236517

    Gloweye
    Member

    Enemy of the Faith helps a lot. Desecration helps a lot. Power Ritual also helps a lot. And Bone Collectors also do decently with Spirit Protection and Demolisher. Disjunct the Great Purge as soon as the Theo activates it, as well as Armageddon.

    Agreed, but not on the Armageddon part, unless you got spare CP.

    Why? Because it’s not as much as a problem for you as it is for other players. Often, the 80% spirit weakness will knock you down to 100% weakness, but if you’re already 60% weak (unaided ghouls) it’s not that far down. Also, all you units already have Cannot Regenerate, and all other forms of healing that a necro uses don’t give a f*** about it.

    The great Purge is a problem, and Holy War if it’s cast. Cast Desecration in battle and disjunct these two. (in and out of combat respectively, of course). Enemy of the Faith is also very good of course.

    #236519

    Bob5
    Member

    Armageddon also gives Strong Will to friendly units, it basically makes the Theo entire army immune to Ghoul curse, Despair, and Invoke Death. Although Crusaders, Exalted, and Shrines already are, the rest (like Evangelists) isn’t.

    #236522

    Charlatan
    Member

    Try to outproduce / overrun them as fast as you can. Being able to gather units quickly is a main advantage of the Necromancer, and if you ask me, necessary to win against Theocrats and Dreadnaughts.

    You don’t want to reach T4 niveau on equal terms of strength/research – Juggernauts and Shrines will obliterate you if you do.

    #236547

    Gloweye
    Member

    Armageddon also gives Strong Will to friendly units, it basically makes the Theo entire army immune to Ghoul curse, Despair, and Invoke Death. Although Crusaders, Exalted, and Shrines already are, the rest (like Evangelists) isn’t.

    This. To me, it still means it’s not as important as disjuncting it would be for other classes.

    #236581

    Try to outproduce / overrun them as fast as you can. Being able to gather units quickly is a main advantage of the Necromancer, and if you ask me, necessary to win against Theocrats and Dreadnaughts.

    You don’t want to reach T4 niveau on equal terms of strength/research – Juggernauts and Shrines will obliterate you if you do.

    Which is pretty much the same as saying that on a large map it is impossible.
    That is really absurd! I believe those two should be archenemies, but from the way it is instead the Theocrat makes playing Necro quite impossible. Who would ever play Necro in multiplayer??

    #236592

    Charlatan
    Member

    Try to outproduce / overrun them as fast as you can. Being able to gather units quickly is a main advantage of the Necromancer, and if you ask me, necessary to win against Theocrats and Dreadnaughts.

    You don’t want to reach T4 niveau on equal terms of strength/research – Juggernauts and Shrines will obliterate you if you do.

    Which is pretty much the same as saying that on a large map it is impossible.
    That is really absurd! I believe those two should be archenemies, but from the way it is instead the Theocrat makes playing Necro quite impossible. Who would ever play Necro in multiplayer??

    mmmh not exactly, remember AI opponents have a bonus in morale and production, human players do not.

    If all continues as planned, you will outproduce the other classes usually and have an immense advantage over any living units.

    You just have to make sure you dominate before mass T3/4 dreadnaught/theocrat units litter the place, which is, lets admit it, the worst case. A powerful Theocrat or Dreadnaught as your last standing enemy at maximum research is an awful scenario, but in usual progress you will overrun them.

    It is unfortunate, but a Necromancer must be more aggressive early than the rest 🙁

    In a little contrast, I may have experienced a similar problem in single player.

    I’ve had a Theocrat enemy obliterate all my strongest units with insane damage shrines and others.

    In a second attempt, I simply rushed him down that small bit more, and he wasn’t able to boast any similar amount of higher tier theocrat units. I was in control.

    #236833

    AbednegoJC
    Member

    Well.. I think this super aggressive early agro, which necromancer has to play doesnt fit this class.. necromancer always used to be slow, fragile (in some way) units, but with overhelming numbers.
    In aow necromancer lategame is very poor, they have shit eco, shit research (because of no happines bonus) and for sure their advantage isnt in numbers.
    Have to say here, their advantage isnt in superstrong units too…
    They have no advantage lategame.

    #236837

    In a second attempt, I simply rushed him down that small bit more, and he wasn’t able to boast any similar amount of higher tier theocrat units. I was in control.

    Well one can rely on rushing against one specific enemy only if he meets him early enough, and still on very large maps it is practically impossible.

    I really find the Necro unplayable at least in multiplayer, too bad the devs think it makes sense that theocrats should dominate them.

    #236840

    AbednegoJC
    Member

    Maybe necromancers should have some bonus for each devout unit on battlefield – similar as shrine has.
    Shrine has insane dmg vs necro – like 50 – 70 on one shot.

    #236851

    Castaneda
    Member

    I love playing them in MP and although not being the winner every time, im not going so badly with them. Desecration, dark gift and life steal make them very strong mid game which is the most important in MP, as you hardly ever get to late game scenarios.
    I admit they are more difficult to play than other combos but also a lot more fun and enjoyable.
    And it´s not always about winning, isn’t it? 😉

    #236857

    I love playing them in MP and although not being the winner every time, im not going so badly with them. Desecration, dark gift and life steal make them very strong mid game which is the most important in MP, as you hardly ever get to late game scenarios.
    I admit they are more difficult to play than other combos but also a lot more fun and enjoyable.
    And it´s not always about winning, isn’t it? 😉

    Do you ever win? Really? In large or XL maps???
    I don’t even think the spell you refer to that gives life steal is a true necromantic spell. If it’s EMBRACE DARKNESS, it’s a SHADOWBORN spell and you can have it with any class. Right now when the enemy starts having shrines I just quit, it’s pathetic… even if it’s not about winning it’s frustrating to be doomed from the beginning.

    #236866

    Do you ever win? Really? In large or XL maps???
    I don’t even think the spell you refer to that gives life steal is a true necromantic spell. If it’s EMBRACE DARKNESS, it’s a SHADOWBORN spell and you can have it with any class. Right now when the enemy starts having shrines I just quit, it’s pathetic… even if it’s not about winning it’s frustrating to be doomed from the beginning.

    The commentator was probably talking about vampiric hunger, which is a necromancer only upgrade.

    Well.. I think this super aggressive early agro, which necromancer has to play doesnt fit this class.. necromancer always used to be slow, fragile (in some way) units, but with overhelming numbers.

    why does it not fit? As the living grow and such, it sort of makes sense for a decay based class to want to aggressively forestall that advantage.

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