[MOD] The Old Man and the Sea

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Home Forums Modding and Map Making [MOD] The Old Man and the Sea

This topic contains 15 replies, has 6 voices, and was last updated by  Edrin 5 years, 1 month ago.

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  • #244813

    Eomolch
    Member

    This mod aims to enrich the water content of the game and increase the relevance of sea units and ships. This is the 2.00 version of the mod which is now featureing an additional sea dwelling. There are however still going to be balancing changes and probably some polishing of the existing content as well as possible additional features.

    ————————
    FEATURES
    ————————

    – harbors unlock a new working boat unit which can construct maritime posts for 80 gold which act like fortresses on water (except they have no defensive value)
    – maritime posts can be upgraded to maritime fortresses for 80 gold (+1 domain)

    – there are 3 new water structures:
    — seaweed: + 30 population; grows in clusters like melons or flowers of solace; visiting units receive 2x fast healing for 3 turns
    — coral reef: treasure site which grants +5 gold +5 mana when explored
    — pearl mine: treasure site which grants +10 gold when explored

    – there are 8 new water units:
    — sea serpent: T3 monster unit; can’t leave water; currently not obtainable for player (except through ghouling)
    — kappa lurker: T1 infantry unit; added to sea dwelling (needs seagrass meadow)
    — kappa hunter: T1 archer unit; added to sea dwelling (needs kelp forest)

    – the other 5 units come from a new sea dwelling: the Nynevians!
    — Kelpie: T1 animal unit; evolves into priestess of nimue; basic dwelling unit
    — Nynevian Archer: T2 irregular unit; requires baracks
    — Nynevian Soldier: T2 infantry unit; requires baracks
    — Priestess of Nimue: T2 support unit; requires temple
    — Nynevian Knight: T3 cavalry unit; requires stables of the rising tide

    – harbors now heal boat units on the coresponding hex by 20% of their hp per turn
    – working boats have repair machine
    – mariner’s guild now additionaly grants mariner to irregular units; human irregulars gain hurl net instead
    – war ships recruitment cost is increased by 40 gold each since their value has dramatically increased

    ————————————
    OPTIONAL FEATURES
    ————————————-

    – by founding a city on top of a maritime post or maritime fortress you can create a water city
    – water cities will spawn produced land units on the nearest land hex
    – water cities have combat maps of land cities except units are embarked / swimming (this is why I call it an optional feature since I can see how this can be a dealbreaker for many players)
    – cities founded upon a maritime fortress will start with a harbor

    ———————————————————————-
    KNOWN ISSUES / PLANS FOR THE FUTURE
    ———————————————————————–

    – working boats appear on land in the city build preview
    – working boats are human for all races (I wanted them to be non-racial but only racial units can construct outposts; if I made one version for each race there would be unwanted side-effects like dwarven working boats being able to traverse mountains…)

    – !unit descriptions!
    – !mythical city upgrades!
    – !new dwelling quests! (still uses reef dwelling quests except with different rewards)

    —————————-
    COMPATIBILITY
    —————————-

    – the mod should only conflict with mods that make their own treasure site additions to the RMG or change the ship units or the sea dwelling
    – thanks to Charlatan, there now is a compatibility patch for the RMG inetgration part of his decodence mod and this mod: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=691916531

    ——————————————-
    MY OTHER MOD PROJECTS
    ——————————————–

    – Hero Development Mod: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=524567032
    – Hero Professions Mod: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=616553983
    – Racial Heritage Mod: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=534176740

    This description was successfully copied and pasted from steam 😀

    • This topic was modified 5 years, 11 months ago by  Eomolch.
    #244832

    Thariorn
    Member

    I’m really liking the boy/sea fortress aspect.

    #244836

    Eomolch
    Member

    Hey Thariorn, I was actually carrying that idea around with me for quite a while now, but there were other mods I wanted to make first and also for some reason I didn’t think of additional treasure sites to complement the sea posts before.

    I also had a couple of other ideas which unfortunately proved to be impossible to realize (defensive spells for the sea post/fortress, ships being able to bombard coastal cities, visit structures that grant resources instead of unit properties/effects). But generally I must say that I am pretty happy with how things turned out now. I will have to see how things will work in real games so I’m also happy about any feedback in that direction (e.g. I am not sure if increasing the ship cost was an overreaction on my part).

    #244890

    Leon Feargus
    Member

    Hi Eomolch,
    Let me start by saying: Great job!
    I’ve only taken a couple of runs but I’m already loving it.

    If you don’t mind I will include some references to my own work, as I have experimented with similar mod-ideas with which I was planning to expand my Fortress Additions mod (coming soon).

    First things first:
    On loadscreen assertion failed message: duplicate ID (frigate/working boat)

    – harbors unlock a new working boat unit which can construct maritime posts for 80 gold which act like fortresses on water (except they have no defensive value)

    – Was planning on a boat just like this one, called Laborers Ship. (in all honesty, I dislike both your name and mine and hope to come up with a better one)
    – Was wanting to give the Laborers Ship the Construct Buoy ability.

    – martitime posts can be upgraded to maritime fortresses for 80 gold (+1 domain)

    – Typo in this description “martitime” should be “partytime”. hehehe
    – How about a slightly different look to differentiate between the post and fortress?
    – The Buoy would only have a 1 hex domain radius and + 3 vision. For looks I thought to take an upturned spydrone, colored red. Haven’t succeeded in implementing yet (game crash).

    – there are 3 new water structures:
    — sea grass: + 30 population; grows in clusters like melons or flowers of solace; visiting units receive 2x fast healing for 3 turns
    — coral reef: treasure site which grants +5 gold +5 mana when explored
    — pearl mine: treasure site which grants +10 gold when explored

    Excellent work, very suiting, very good-looking.
    – The new sites are guarded more heavily than land structures with similar values. Quite often there are t3 and t4 involved. I think the guards are ok but the rewards should be slightly higher.(how about +5 research i.o. +5 gold for the reef)
    – I am seeing many defending Lurkers and only a handful of Hunters, is this intentional?
    – On several occassions I’ve seen 2 of the new structures on adjacent hexes. just an observation, I guess that’s fine. (the defenders don’t seem to be cooperating)
    – The Pearl mine sometimes appears adjacent to coastline. Also fine, however, take note that those structures are easily explored without having to embark an army and its resources easily harvested by landbound builders.

    – there are 3 new water units:
    — sea serpent: T3 monster unit; can’t leave water; currently not obtainable for player (except through ghouling)
    — kappa lurker: T1 infantry unit; added to sea dwelling (needs seagrass meadow)
    — kappa hunter: T1 archer unit; added to sea dwelling (needs kelp forest)

    Totally love these new units!!! Please teach me to create units like this! 🙂
    – perhaps give throw net ability on medal to hunter.

    – harbors now heal boat units on the coresponding hex by 20% of their hp per turn
    – working boats have repair machine
    – mariner’s guild now additionaly grants mariner to irregular units; human irregulars gain hurl net instead
    – war ships recruitment cost is increased by 40 gold each since their value has dramatically increased

    – Harbors repairing machines is a good decision.
    – Was thinking of adding the Repair Machine ability to the Laborers Ship only when built by cities with a Masters Guild (similar to the Builder).
    – Good one on Mariner’s guild as well.
    – Good call on the price increase. (did you include the ironclad?)

    – by founding a city on top of a maritime post or maritime fortress you can create a water city

    This is what made me hesitate to create Buoys.

    – water cities will spawn produced land units on the nearest land hex
    – water cities have combat maps of land cities except units are embarked / swimming (this is why I call it an optional feature since I can see how this can be a dealbreaker for many players)

    These were the prime reasons for the hesitation mentioned above. What do you mean by optional feature? How would that be implemented?

    – cities founded upon a maritime fortress will start with a harbor

    This one’s nice though. Makes me think … would it be possible to add a structure that adds the Embarked property so built land-units do appear in the city?

    – working boats appear on land in the city build preview
    – working boats are human for all races (I wanted them to be non-racial but only racial units can construct outposts; if I made one version for each race there would be unwanted side-effects like dwarven working boats being able to traverse mountains…)

    I don’t understand the problem here. You can have non-racial ships to build the Maritime Post and settlers to build an outpost on top of them, can’t you?
    As of now, the maritime structures devour settlers with no effect, this is bad.

    – ?different combat maps for new treasure sites?
    – ?more new units?
    – ?combat spells for new treasure sites?
    – !unit descriptions!
    – !mythical city upgrades!

    TC-maps: would be grand, but difficult to implement I think.
    Units: a female Kappa unit.
    Spells: why not, no priority though.
    Descriptions: need some help?
    Mcu’s:
    – Seaweed: Seafood Kitchen: Produced Supports gain Cure Disease
    – Coral Reef: Ridge of Razorblades: Pike and Infantry gain Inflict Bleeding Wounds.
    – Pearl Mine: Kraken Nursery: Produce Baby Kraken (remove from merfolk)

    Thanks for all the hard work and please try Fortress Additions mod when it’s ready.

    • This reply was modified 5 years, 12 months ago by  Leon Feargus.
    #244934

    Eomolch
    Member

    Hi Leon Feargus, first let me say that I strongly appreciate your detailed feedback. This is gold for me 😉

    First things first:
    On loadscreen assertion failed message: duplicate ID (frigate/working boat)

    Whoops, I thought I had copied it in the new .clb again to avoid this. Good catch.

    – harbors unlock a new working boat unit which can construct maritime posts for 80 gold which act like fortresses on water (except they have no defensive value)

    – Was planning on a boat just like this one, called Laborers Ship. (in all honesty, I dislike both your name and mine and hope to come up with a better one)
    – Was wanting to give the Laborers Ship the Construct Buoy ability.

    I agree. I took the name from civ V, but if someone comes up with a better name I’m all ears.

    – martitime posts can be upgraded to maritime fortresses for 80 gold (+1 domain)

    – Typo in this description “martitime” should be “partytime”. hehehe
    – How about a slightly different look to differentiate between the post and fortress?
    – The Buoy would only have a 1 hex domain radius and + 3 vision. For looks I thought to take an upturned spydrone, colored red. Haven’t succeeded in implementing yet (game crash).

    I also thought about different looks, but didn’t have a good (and relatively easy) idea for it yet. But it is something I will try to tinker with when I get the time.

    As for your buoy idea, since you only need a prop without animation it shouldn’t be a problem to do this. You will have to use the content editor and copy the spydrone mesh to your own .clb. Then you can rotate the mesh there and assign it to the prop with the right material. By right material I mean a recolored spydrone mat, depending on how it works you may either be able to do the recoloring in the content editor or make a new material where you recolor the diffuse map in photoshop/gimp (see tibbles snow serpent tutorial for that).

    – The new sites are guarded more heavily than land structures with similar values. Quite often there are t3 and t4 involved. I think the guards are ok but the rewards should be slightly higher.(how about +5 research i.o. +5 gold for the reef)

    Hm, this is a tough one. It took me some time to get the RMG to create defenders with some good variety and power so I don’t think I will make some changes there. I’m a little hesitant about increasing the structure income since the values I chose just seemed right and fitting from a thematic point of view. So maybe it would suffice just to increase the exploration rewards for some degree.

    – I am seeing many defending Lurkers and only a handful of Hunters, is this intentional?

    I still haven’t figured out how exactly the RMG works with adventure sets, so no it is not intentional. It could be because the lurkers have a slightly higher stack priority or because they have slightly lower building cost.

    – On several occassions I’ve seen 2 of the new structures on adjacent hexes. just an observation, I guess that’s fine. (the defenders don’t seem to be cooperating)

    I actually like that this happens 😀

    – The Pearl mine sometimes appears adjacent to coastline. Also fine, however, take note that those structures are easily explored without having to embark an army and its resources easily harvested by landbound builders.

    Are you certain that they can be explored without embarking? I thought this “bug” was removed a while ago.

    Totally love these new units!!! Please teach me to create units like this! :)
    – perhaps give throw net ability on medal to hunter.

    Thanks! 🙂 (though I’m still a little undecided whether sea serpent abilities are good or if there could be done sth more creative)

    I’m afraid however that I can’t teach you how to create units like that because they are always a product of lots of experimentation and just testing stuff on my part. I usually have some idea which mesh/unit to use as a base and what could be done with it to make it look like I want it to. Then I play around with materials and additional meshes (with the same skeleton!) and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn’t. It is really a lot about just trying out ideas and looking where it takes you. (In case of the kappas the starting idea was to use the hatchling with a rig where it had a more humanoid pose to differentiate it from the normal hatchlings.)

    – Was thinking of adding the Repair Machine ability to the Laborers Ship only when built by cities with a Masters Guild (similar to the Builder).

    I was wondering where the repair machine ability of the builder went 😀 Maybe a compromise would be to grant the repair machine ability only when advanced seafaring is researched.

    – Good call on the price increase. (did you include the ironclad?)

    Yes 😉

    These were the prime reasons for the hesitation mentioned above. What do you mean by optional feature? How would that be implemented?

    I mean that players who have a problem with these immersion-breakers shouldn’t use it. The AI won’t found cities like that on their own.

    This one’s nice though. Makes me think … would it be possible to add a structure that adds the Embarked property so built land-units do appear in the city?

    Don’t think that would be possible. Though I might be wrong.

    – working boats appear on land in the city build preview
    – working boats are human for all races (I wanted them to be non-racial but only racial units can construct outposts; if I made one version for each race there would be unwanted side-effects like dwarven working boats being able to traverse mountains…)

    I don’t understand the problem here. You can have non-racial ships to build the Maritime Post and settlers to build an outpost on top of them, can’t you?
    As of now, the maritime structures devour settlers with no effect, this is bad.

    No, you can’t have non-racial ships have building the maritime post. It crashes the game (my guess is that it looks for the link for the right icon in the panel where you give the outpost a name, which is race-dependent). Also I don’t understand the second sentence. Why do they devour settlers with no effect? The city founding does work.

    TC-maps: would be grand, but difficult to implement I think.

    Yep, that’s why I put it into question marks^^

    Units: a female Kappa unit.

    😀 wouldn’t that be ugly? what I’d really like to do is recreate the “Wassertänzer” (no idea how it was called in english, the T2 water summon from aow2) but I didn’t have an idea yet how to get a good model (and rig) for it

    Descriptions: need some help?

    Not sure yet 😀 It is just so time-consuming for a non-essential feature.

    Mcu’s:
    – Seaweed: Seafood Kitchen: Produced Supports gain Cure Disease
    – Coral Reef: Ridge of Razorblades: Pike and Infantry gain Inflict Bleeding Wounds.
    – Pearl Mine: Kraken Nursery: Produce Baby Kraken (remove from merfolk)

    – Seaweed: cure disease is already a support unit thingy and I think this would take away the differences between those who have it and those who don’t. also I don’t really want a MCU for the seaweed anyway since it would diverge from the base game’s policy on cluster visit sites
    – coral reef: nice idea, maybe with a flat damage bonus it could do.
    – pearl mine: this could only make sense if I also changed the summon baby kraken spell (adept of water) to something else. even in that case I would probably prefer the sea serpent variant…

    Thanks for all the hard work and please try Fortress Additions mod when it’s ready.

    Well thanks for the feedback 🙂 And let me know when your mod is finished 😉

    • This reply was modified 5 years, 12 months ago by  Eomolch.
    #244937

    Thariorn
    Member

    I agree. I took the name from civ V, but if someone comes up with a better name I’m all ears.

    How’bout Tubgoat?

    As in ships which haul bigger/damaged ships back into their harbors.

    Would, kinda, work in the context of “Ships which build stuff”

    Leon Feargus wrote:
    TC-maps: would be grand, but difficult to implement I think.
    Yep, that’s why I put it into question marks^

    AfaIk that won’t be possiblee per sé, as you can only tweak existing TCs thorugh Hex-editing (Gloweye/Charlatan would know more about this)

    wouldn’t that be ugly? what I’d really like to do is recreate the “Wassertänzer” (no idea how it was called in english, the T2 water summon from aow2) but I didn’t have an idea yet how to get a good model (and rig) for it

    The “Wassertänzer” simply is translated to waterdancer

    Maybe repurpose an Ice Wyvern (To get those flapped arms) and rig it onto the Naga Matriarch?
    But I dunno how that would look/work because I haven’t rigged anything in the CE yet.

    #244947

    Gloweye
    Member

    Eomolch wrote:
    Leon Feargus wrote:
    TC-maps: would be grand, but difficult to implement I think.
    Yep, that’s why I put it into question marks^
    AfaIk that won’t be possiblee per sé, as you can only tweak existing TCs thorugh Hex-editing (Gloweye/Charlatan would know more about this)

    I know more. It’s clicking a hell of a lot of assertions, and then still getting scolded about the data stream expected sizes even when you adjust the name sizes. In short, it’s not going to work aside from rpk-level hacks. (you can use them to replace structures based on overlay)

    #245049

    Eomolch
    Member

    How’bout Tubgoat?

    As in ships which haul bigger/damaged ships back into their harbors.

    Would, kinda, work in the context of “Ships which build stuff”

    A tubgoat must be a truly terrifying creature 😀 If it had another e it would probably live in the London metro.

    But seriously Tugboat seems like a great idea.

    The “Wassertänzer” simply is translated to waterdancer

    Maybe repurpose an Ice Wyvern (To get those flapped arms) and rig it onto the Naga Matriarch?
    But I dunno how that would look/work because I haven’t rigged anything in the CE yet.

    That wouldn’t work and I don’t think the matriarch rig would have the set of animations I would expect from the water dancer. Sadly none of the existing rigs has :/ The closest thing would be the fairies, but I already checked and it would not really fit for a unit that isn’t supposed to be flying/floating.

    @gloweye: I know this, after all I asked you in another thread (and charlatan on another occasion). I just didn’t want to rule it out 100% yet, because well, you never know what is gonna happen.

    #245050

    Gloweye
    Member

    Yeah well, I tried to get the dev’s to release the editor they use for the maps, but I was unsuccessful. Dont remember the exact wording, but “a bug-ridden support nightmare” sums it up pretty much.

    Got my hopes for it for AoW 4 tho, if we’re ever gonna get there.

    #245059

    wusong
    Member

    Hello Eomolch,

    The description and images are very impressive…

    I am curious to try it but steamworkshopdownloader is down, can you please upload the mod to other location ?

    I wanted to thank you again for RACIAL HERITAGE Mod I do not see myself playing without it.

    #245073

    Leon Feargus
    Member

    I also thought about different looks, but didn’t have a good (and relatively easy) idea for it yet. But it is something I will try to tinker with when I get the time.

    I took a peek at your clb’s and only now noticed the watchtower on the fortress, so there is a distinction already but it could be more noticeable.

    Are you certain that they can be explored without embarking? I thought this “bug” was removed a while ago.

    Oops sorry, you’re right.

    Then I play around with materials and additional meshes (with the same skeleton!) and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn’t. It is really a lot about just trying out ideas and looking where it takes you.

    This is enough teaching to get me going, thanks. I actually never noticed he NEW and DELETE buttons because they were partially hidden by my cpu’s interface.

    I mean that players who have a problem with these immersion-breakers shouldn’t use it. The AI won’t found cities like that on their own.

    Do you have any plans to try and make it work for AI? I did some experiments with my mod, without much succes unfortunately.

    No, you can’t have non-racial ships have building the maritime post. It crashes the game (my guess is that it looks for the link for the right icon in the panel where you give the outpost a name, which is race-dependent). Also I don’t understand the second sentence. Why do they devour settlers with no effect? The city founding does work.

    I’ve just tried again and I can’t settle the maritime fortress. The settler is gone but the fortress remains a fortress.

    I did a run as Expander and Rugged Pioneers did not put Mountaneering on my Worker Boat, so you might want to try and go for racial boats after all.

    Made a seperate mod-test myself and indeed game crashes when building a fortress with a regular boat unit. I once had a set-up where I used embarked builders but they would respawn on a land tile, leaving the built structure independent.

    Some suggestions:
    – When I was working on my Laborer Ship I was planning to mount it with a crane (borrowed from builder unit), might be nice for flavor.
    – What do you think about adding the Buoy idea to your mod? (Buoy would be 1 hex domain radius and +5 vision). I really like the prospect of making our mods compatible and the Buoy fits your mod better.

    #245145

    Eomolch
    Member

    * updated the starting post (this mod is now featuring a new sea dwelling)

    I took a peek at your clb’s and only now noticed the watchtower on the fortress, so there is a distinction already but it could be more noticeable.

    That is because I added this change after your (former) post.

    This is enough teaching to get me going, thanks. I actually never noticed he NEW and DELETE buttons because they were partially hidden by my cpu’s interface.

    Have fun 😉

    Do you have any plans to try and make it work for AI? I did some experiments with my mod, without much succes unfortunately.

    Pretty sure this can’t be done. The AI won’t even build cities on (regular) outposts (or build outposts or roads in that respect).

    I’ve just tried again and I can’t settle the maritime fortress. The settler is gone but the fortress remains a fortress.

    We clarified this yesterday 😛

    I did a run as Expander and Rugged Pioneers did not put Mountaneering on my Worker Boat, so you might want to try and go for racial boats after all.

    This is because I changed rugged pioneers to only give the mountaineering part to non-boat laborer units.

    Made a seperate mod-test myself and indeed game crashes when building a fortress with a regular boat unit. I once had a set-up where I used embarked builders but they would respawn on a land tile, leaving the built structure independent.

    Also builders are racial too ^^

    Some suggestions:
    – When I was working on my Laborer Ship I was planning to mount it with a crane (borrowed from builder unit), might be nice for flavor.

    If there is an easy way to achieve this, it is a nice idea (I was thinking about sth like this too), but I doubt the crane has its own mesh :/

    – What do you think about adding the Buoy idea to your mod? (Buoy would be 1 hex domain radius and +5 vision). I really like the prospect of making our mods compatible and the Buoy fits your mod better.

    Well, if you remove the domain part and thus make it a water equivalent to the watchtower it could work. Given I can find a convincing model 🙂

    ————-
    whoops, almost forgot: @wusong: I can see if I can upload the mod on the Nexus page. If it looks easy I will do it soonish, else I’m afraid you’ll have to wait a little more since I expect the mod to undergo several smaller updates in the next time and don’t want to make the update process any more complicated. 🙁

    • This reply was modified 5 years, 11 months ago by  Eomolch.
    #245226

    wusong
    Member

    Hi,

    Thank you.

    Just want to update that i bought AOW3 from steam in the last week sale.

    Wusong

    #251946

    Edrin
    Member

    And what about GOG players? Is it possible to upload it on the nexus, or somewhere?
    Thank you

    #251948

    wusong
    Member
    #251954

    Edrin
    Member

    You can use the site http://steamworkshopdownloader.com/

    That one is a life saver! Bookmarked!
    Thank you!

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