Nerf [removed by SikBok] Sorcery

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Home Forums Age of Wonders 3 Discussions Nerf [removed by SikBok] Sorcery

This topic contains 77 replies, has 26 voices, and was last updated by  Fenraellis 8 years ago.

Viewing 30 posts - 1 through 30 (of 78 total)
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  • #135563

    Pesky
    Member

    I put a fucking sorcerer ai into my game just to regret this shit later on. Doesn’t help AI already cheats, but jesus fucking christ, can you even counter sorcerer as warlord?????????? Literally stun-locked, melee units cant do anything, or they get static shielded, try to disjunct it, only have 60 points, fail, get stunned, die. I want to have fun not fucking stun locked 24/7 even resorted to cheating to win because I cant get around eldritch horrors with static shield, panic, with support units constantly stunning me 24/7, and I’ve tried manticores and pikemen for them, horsemen for supports, they just get stunned even when support melee attack them wtf??

    fuck sorcery
    after game my blood pressure skyrockets

    #135564

    Pesky
    Member

    if u want fun never put sorcery kids into your game if u play sorcerer in MP kill yourself

    #135569

    Thariorn
    Member

    Well, seems someone has a problem of how to properly express himself….

    Anyway, did you try running some, let’s say 1-2, tank units (e.g. mantircore riders/warbreeed/phalanx) to tank everything (With the use of last stand which negates any lethal dmg until its dispelled/out of duration) and the rest archers/monster hunters(Mhs fpr their slayer attributes)?

    #135572

    Brandon_354
    Member

    Well, seems someone has a problem of how to properly express himself….

    Anyway, did you try running some, let’s say 1-2, tank units (e.g. mantircore riders/warbreeed/phalanx) to tank everything (With the use of last stand which negates any lethal dmg until its dispelled/out of duration) and the rest archers/monster hunters(Mhs fpr their slayer attributes)?

    I believe you mean steadfast ward but that doesn’t solve his problem. warlord is a primarily melee class so whether he has a tank or not he is still going to melee. monster hunters ranged damage is sub par late game which i believe is when static shield is a problem from a sorc

    Still he comes off as EXTREMELY aggressive, and not only in this thread.

    #135580

    terrahero
    Member

    Dial down the difficulty untill you are mor familiar with the Warlord and the Sorcerer.
    And with comments suggesting people who play Sorcerer should commit suicide i forsee a lengthy forum vacation in your near future.

    #135585

    Just for the tone alone, which is a recurrent characteristic in Pesky’s posts, I foresee and recommend a lengthy vacation.

    Learn to talk properly.

    Then come and ask for advice.

    Also, Warlord is one of the toughest classes to use effectively, and you are comparing it to the easiest to use class…

    Assuming your skill level is equal, you will lose against a Sorc more often than not using a Warlord.

    However, you mentioned some.late game units, which inclined me to say that if you survive to the late game, you should be dominating massively.

    How are your heroes geared up?

    if this is multiplayer, then the Sorc player only has so much he can concentrate on, and you should be putting out 2-3 Manticores or Warbreeds for every one of their Horrors.

    Tool your heroes up, or get a stack of Warbreeds and death march them. You should know where all his cities are by now. Capture and burn them.

    If this is single player then you have *no* excuse. The ai can’t use it’s troops ad well as a Human, so you can “cheese” it.

    #135588

    Lannister
    Member

    If this is single player then you have *no* excuse. The ai can’t use it’s troops ad well as a Human, so you can “cheese” it.

    AI emperor produces t4 units turn 40, casts static electricity or worse chaos rift turn 50 with cheaty spellpoints. Hard to believe any Human player no matter skill can win againt the emperor AI when it was teching unmolested and shows up turn 60 with all its crap.

    To the OP, your problem is Emperor and yes it cheats. Lower the difficulty or number of AI and scout destroy before their cheat takes full effect and they have one t4 for every t2 you produce. A : Sorceress is a Troll class that stuns melee for breakfast and means you have to Troll it back, dont fight the sorc game and spammmmmmmmmm them thourubred Horse Archers, trebuchets and use a few melee as stun lock targets. B: Use dwarf or High elf with +1 resistance, avoid Orcs at all costs the -1 resistance will screw you. C: Hold out to Global Assault, Sorcress is helpless to Global Assault warlord horse archers with 90hp XD.

    TL;DR – USE HORSE ARCHERS , Don’t Melee Static Electricity Sorc AI troll spamming.

    #135590

    Socratatus
    Member

    Steady on with the swearing. You should be ignored for such a foul mouth.

    I do understand the problem because I play Warlord too and it is hard against Sorcerers even AI, but clean up how you talk and maybe I will support you more.

    #135593

    SaintTodd
    Member

    I see now. Based on the title, I thought they added a new kind of magic to the game. A very sexy kind of magic.

    #135604

    Draxynnic
    Member

    You may be thinking of Courtesan Ambassadors. 😛

    #135609

    Agree, it can usually take a Sorcerer using a Warlord , but I just cannot even think to start playing against the AI at Eemperor level, using a Rogue leader.

    The game is very unbalanced regarding classes with the rogue being the weakest one and the sorcerer being the strongest.

    Heavy re-balance needed
    At the very least the rogue should be made stronger.

    (PS. I couldn’t care less if you like to express yourself like a fucking retarded teen, but you are gonna get yourself kicked out of the forum for nothing).

    #135610

    Sorax
    Keymaster

    Hi Pesky,

    Please have a look on our forum terms of use:
    http://ageofwonders.com/forums/topic/please-follow-our-terms-of-use/

    * Try to keep it nice. No swearing or cursing other forum users.
    * Don’t personally attack other users or use insults.
    * Stay on-topic.

    The way you are describing the issue is certainly worth an official warning, bad luck for you, your recent posts contain more stuff we don’t like to see on our forums:

    http://ageofwonders.com/forums/topic/dev-journal-cities-of-the-dead/page/5/#post-134966

    http://ageofwonders.com/forums/topic/dont-fear-the-reaper/#post-135390

    http://ageofwonders.com/forums/topic/nerf-fucking-sorcery/#post-135563

    http://ageofwonders.com/forums/topic/ai-empire-excessively-high-happiness/#post-135565

    Hence I feel free to jump immediately to your second strike: Consider this post your second warning, 3rd one will come with consequences.

    @all: Please do not refer any longer to how much inappropriate OP is/was. This could be seen as off-topic. Thank you.

    I leave the thread open in case someone wants to further discuss the actual content.

    Regards,
    Sorax

    #135611

    Sorax
    Keymaster

    like a fucking retarded teen

    Why? I don’t get it….sigh.

    Hi THE Black Knight,

    Please have a look on our forum terms of use:
    http://ageofwonders.com/forums/topic/please-follow-our-terms-of-use/

    * Try to keep it nice. No swearing or cursing other forum users.
    * Don’t personally attack other users or use insults.
    * Stay on-topic.

    Consider this post your first warning, 3rd one will come with consequences.

    Regards,
    Sorax

    #135612

    Ericridge
    Member

    @lannister Don’t the AI not get bonus casting points anymore? All the casting points they have now comes from research and palaces.

    #135619

    Hide
    Member

    @lannister Don’t the AI not get bonus casting points anymore? All the casting points they have now comes from research and palaces.

    Well, that’s more than enough. But I also think that AI doesn’t really care about the double casting-price if the leader is not actively taking part in the battle.

    #135628

    Brandon_354
    Member

    @lannister Don’t the AI not get bonus casting points anymore? All the casting points they have now comes from research and palaces.

    I’d think otherwise. I played a capital only game (no cities and no founding) and despite the ai’s leader not being on the battlefield he cast resurrect 2 or 3 times along with a couple suffocate spells.

    #135667

    Pesky
    Member

    sorry for language but when ur blood pressure in sky (like mine was) then u would understand

    #135668

    Pesky
    Member

    also it was semi-late game considering the ai cheats he is far ahead of me in city, i dont have trouble against any other class other than sorcery. the horse archers sound decent, but he could just use chain lightning to kill them then have 1 eldritch horror kill probably 3 of them (and i try my best to spread out my units).

    Also, don’t tell me to talk properly. I did not come for advice, considering I’m never adding a sorcerer AI into my game. I came just to catch people’s eye, even though they probably already know it, that Sorcerer is very op class. Also I stay true to my word, chances are I will dislike you if I saw you as a Sorcerer in MP, but I do not play MP considering it is too slow and riddled with delay.

    Another thing, last stand only gives physical defence, not resistance lol?? Also I believe I had shock defense on my hero, but I was not fighting sorcerer since I was at war with 2 other AI, who I had no trouble with. I did not have the gold to have 2 warbreeds/manticores each time. I think I had only 3 – 4 cities, also funny thing is for last stand, It did NOT want to show up in my research book, and steadfast costs 40 casting points which is too much. I actually cheated in an army of manticores and he just stun-locked me to death. He does not need Eldritch horrors, but OP tier 2 support units. If I started with Hellfire spell, this would have been very easy.

    Thanks for advice anyway though.

    #135671

    Ericridge
    Member

    You might want to return to LoL Pesky because you’re acting like this game is an mmorpg -.-

    That game is known for bad language.

    #135673

    Pesky
    Member

    theres so many things wrong with ur post im not even going to give my time to share them with you

    #135674

    Another thing, last stand only gives physical defence, not resistance lol??

    it gives extra defense and the ability “defender”, which doubles the defending bonus, including for resistance.

    Anyway, warlords have a few options when fighting sorcerers (it is an uphill battle until the mid-late game, yes).

    Probably the most important is the choice of race, since all the warlord’s units are racial and produced in cities. Dwarves and Elves are standout choices, since Dwarves get you extra defense and resistance, while Elves get you shock resistant supports, High Elf Horse-archers (who are the finest archers in the game), and extra resistance.

    Halflings are also very useful, as you get extra morale, luck, good archers, and the class can mitigate their physical weakness (martial arts and the leader upgrade).

    Then there are the specializations. Warlords generally need something with a direct damage spell, like fire, or something with a resistance boost, like creation. Wild magic is also super useful, since it lets you get a powerful summon (the lesser elemental), remove physical resistance, damage enemies’ defense, and switch your tough melee units with their weak ranged ones.

    Wild magic, creation, and fire adept gives you a nice mix of all of those. It is especially useful for Dwarf warlords, who can combine guardian flames/fire bolts with oily skin/degenerate.

    Manticores and Warbreed are also the worst units to send against apprentices. Indeed, the purpose of the apprentice is to stop big tough melee units (with relatively low resistance) from closing. It is like using tanks to fight tank destroyers.

    Instead, use unicorn riders, gryphon riders or eagle riders. The warlord upgrades allow you to produce them more cheaply, give them more hp, medals, etc.

    Unicorn riders are just the best for this. They have high resistance, are cheaper than apprentices even without the boosts, and can phase, thus skipping the shocking death area.

    If you keep the eagle riders happy, they’ll dodge stuns all day long.

    Gryphon riders have as high resistance as default manticore riders (12), have first strike (so an apprentice gets struck twice by a gryphon rider before it can retaliate for a stun chance if you fly it behind one), and are just generally excellent units.

    Throw curse should also be taken advantage of (on the Orc priest). Since two failed curses strips all mp from a unit, two of them can make an apprentice only get one stun chance against an attacking unit before it closes.

    Otherwise, Dreadnought heroes (with force field and the shock resistance boost) theocrat heroes (with touch of faith and a resistance boost), and sorcerer heroes (phase, resistance boost, their own inflict stun, healing, dispel) are always useful.

    #135676

    Pesky
    Member

    wtf really?? is that new or did I just not look at it very carefully? also I only play human and orc warlord for RP purposes.

    ive tried using manticores for supports along with killing spree they just get stunned because of static shield lol. its stupid they have a chance of being double stunned when they are ones attacking and its not a flank. basically means, even if u had 50% luck, you’ll probably get hit up to 5 times giving a chance of being stunned, or more cus the ai basically masses support units.

    #135679

    Brandon_354
    Member

    You might want to return to LoL Pesky because you’re acting like this game is an mmorpg -.-

    That game is known for bad language.

    Actually LoL is a MOBA and it isn’t the only one that way saddly. All MOBAs have absolutely terrible communities because of how heavily team based it is so when one person slips up a bit a war on your own team breaks out.

    #135683

    SaintTodd
    Member

    <div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Pesky wrote:</div>
    Another thing, last stand only gives physical defence, not resistance lol??

    it gives extra defense and the ability “defender”, which doubles the defending bonus, including for resistance.

    Anyway, warlords have a few options when fighting sorcerers (it is an uphill battle until the mid-late game, yes).

    Probably the most important is the choice of race, since all the warlord’s units are racial and produced in cities. Dwarves and Elves are standout choices, since Dwarves get you extra defense and resistance, while Elves get you shock resistant supports, High Elf Horse-archers (who are the finest archers in the game), and extra resistance.

    Halflings are also very useful, as you get extra morale, luck, good archers, and the class can mitigate their physical weakness (martial arts and the leader upgrade).

    Then there are the specializations. Warlords generally need something with a direct damage spell, like fire, or something with a resistance boost, like creation. Wild magic is also super useful, since it lets you get a powerful summon (the lesser elemental), remove physical resistance, damage enemies’ defense, and switch your tough melee units with their weak ranged ones.

    Wild magic, creation, and fire adept gives you a nice mix of all of those. It is especially useful for Dwarf warlords, who can combine guardian flames/fire bolts with oily skin/degenerate.

    Manticores and Warbreed are also the worst units to send against apprentices. Indeed, the purpose of the apprentice is to stop big tough melee units (with relatively low resistance) from closing. It is like using tanks to fight tank destroyers.

    Instead, use unicorn riders, gryphon riders or eagle riders. The warlord upgrades allow you to produce them more cheaply, give them more hp, medals, etc.

    Unicorn riders are just the best for this. They have high resistance, are cheaper than apprentices even without the boosts, and can phase, thus skipping the shocking death area.

    If you keep the eagle riders happy, they’ll dodge stuns all day long.

    Gryphon riders have as high resistance as default manticore riders (12), have first strike (so an apprentice gets struck twice by a gryphon rider before it can retaliate for a stun chance if you fly it behind one), and are just generally excellent units.

    Throw curse should also be taken advantage of (on the Orc priest). Since two failed curses strips all mp from a unit, two of them can make an apprentice only get one stun chance against an attacking unit before it closes.

    Otherwise, Dreadnought heroes (with force field and the shock resistance boost) theocrat heroes (with touch of faith and a resistance boost), and sorcerer heroes (phase, resistance boost, their own inflict stun, healing, dispel) are always useful.

    So, in short, I am handicapping myself by playing as a human warlord. Kinda thought so.

    #135684

    Pesky
    Member

    <div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Ericridge wrote:</div>
    You might want to return to LoL Pesky because you’re acting like this game is an mmorpg -.-

    That game is known for bad language.

    Actually LoL is a MOBA and it isn’t the only one that way saddly. All MOBAs have absolutely terrible communities because of how heavily team based it is so when one person slips up a bit a war on your own team breaks out.

    tell ’em

    #135685

    Draxynnic
    Member

    Gryphon riders have as high resistance as default manticore riders (12), have first strike (so an apprentice gets struck twice by a gryphon rider before it can retaliate for a stun chance if you fly it behind one), and are just generally excellent units.

    First strike doesn’t matter when attacking unless the defender also has First Strike (in which case they cancel one another out). Getting an extra attack without being retaliated against is a natural result of flanking attacks, not from First Strike.

    The main advantage of gryphons in this scenario is that you can generally have more of them, which makes it that much harder for the sorcerer to stun them all.

    #135687

    First strike doesn’t matter when attacking unless the defender also has First Strike (in which case they cancel one another out). Getting an extra attack without being retaliated against is a natural result of flanking attacks, not from First Strike.

    I meant that you could flank at maximum range, get one charge strike in then ending the turn. The next turn, you get another strike when the apprentice tries to melee (and get the stun).

    Of course, you can use another unit to make the gryphon rider turn around, thus avoiding this, but it is still something useful if you can tie up other nearby apprentices.

    #135694

    also I only play human and orc warlord for RP purposes.

    Well, that is an important thing to note before complaining about game balance. Orc warlords are the weakest race class combination vs any kind of sorcerer (or anyone with lots of non physical damage).

    Humans are much better, since they have ordinary resistance, and most importantly, bestow iron heart. When combined with the defender effect of last stand, you get an extra 2 resistance on your units, thus reducing the stun chance by roughly 10%.

    Of course, they lack flying racial units, which is a big problem when fighting mobile sorcerers.

    Probably the best thing is to give iron heart (from priests) to monster hunters, who have default 20% shock protection, and combine this with bestow iron heart or bless, and mix them together with horse archers.

    So you have wild magic adept, air adept, and fire adept. Wild magic adept lets you warp the equipment of the apprentices/swap in monster hunters (since they are equal tiers), air adept gets you seeker and a physical direct damage spell (since apprentices have higher resistance than defense), and fire adept gives you fireballs for wisps/phantasm warriors.

    ive tried using manticores for supports along with killing spree they just get stunned because of static shield lol. its stupid they have a chance of being double stunned when they are ones attacking and its not a flank. basically means, even if u had 50% luck, you’ll probably get hit up to 5 times giving a chance of being stunned, or more cus the ai basically masses support units.

    I said not to use manticore riders. They are too expensive to mass against apprentices effectively. If the sorcerer likes to use static electricity, then use horse archers.

    Indeed, even an orc horse archer with seeker from an air adept can reliably kill apprentices.

    #135698

    Draxynnic
    Member

    I thought bestow iron heart just provided 15 healing and Strong Will – it doesn’t boost resistance against shock.

    #135699

    Pesky
    Member

    if i cant play orc warlord to kill sorcerer theres something wrong

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