Possible flaw in island random map with dwellings

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Home Forums Age of Wonders 3 Discussions Possible flaw in island random map with dwellings

This topic contains 5 replies, has 3 voices, and was last updated by  Dr_K 7 years, 11 months ago.

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  • #105325

    Bouh
    Member

    I noticed two times in a row, on an island randomly generated map, the player one was on a rather large island with a powerful dwelling (dragon den the first time, undead city the second) and a faery dwelling a little farther (same island the first time, the closest island the second time).

    The player one might also have been a little farther from bunch of cities than player two.

    This would be a flaw if the player one is blessed with powerful dwellings, but two times could be a coincidence or the start of a trend.

    Did anyone noticed the same ?

    #105354

    Dr_K
    Member

    I’ve noticed something similar, but I had assumed that it was just coincidence. It ended up being 4 players each at one of the corners. The player in the upper right and lower left both got a giant and dragon dwelling respectively on a very close islands.

    I also went through and tried to randomly generate some different Island maps to see if I could recreate something like it. After about 10 maps of each size Small/Medium/Large with all average settings, it happened a couple of times on the Small and Medium maps. One of the players ended up with usually a Giant/Archon/Dragon dwelling on a close Island. I think it was more coincidence than actual flaw, but there might be a way to improve Dwelling placement.

    Something else I noticed doing this is that on Large maps (using 6 players) was that there were NO dwellings anywhere (all settings set to Average). This could just be the random number generator, but it seemed a bit odd. Also apparently cities can be placed on Water and Impassable Water for random maps.

    #105358

    Bouh
    Member

    Also apparently cities can be placed on Water and Impassable Water for random maps. Yeah, I had this once too : a city was placed on a water tile with rocks, hence only flying units could go on the central city hex.

    I forgot to say that my first map was with 4 players and the second was with 2, both with standard setting and no underground.

    Your tests seem to point to a coincidence. I was surprised though, as the two maps were similar on this matter (player one on a big island with dragon/undead dwelling, and faery dwelling nearby, like 3 days far).

    #105374

    SmurfInHell
    Member

    I enjoy the random map generation, but I have to admit there are a couple problems with the generation. I’ve had the city on top of a water tile with rocks before, and while my friends and I ended up turning it into a fantastic time with great stories… In a MP match or more serious case it could have been quite devastating.

    I wish I knew more about the map generation itself. There are some games where you get an absolutely amazing setup and others that you can barely manage. It’s exactly what it says: Random.

    I’m not sure if the map generation should be looked at to fix things like the water/rock cities, or if I should see them as a strategically smart decision created by luck. (As they do give some absolutely hilarious stories to talk about!)

    #105380

    Bouh
    Member

    Indeed I don’t think the RMG should be contrained too much, because it would lose all the random part.

    I actually like that the RMG can give you anything. I remember in AoW2 I once been placed completely surrounded by mountains which were only passable by flying units or with mountaineering. This is both a liability and a blessing, because it works both ways. This makes for fun stories and should not be changed.

    When I talk about flaws, I talked really about flaws in the random part of the RMG which would make things predictable and hence not good.

    #105381

    Dr_K
    Member

    I’m not sure if the map generation should be looked at to fix things like the water/rock cities, or if I should see them as a strategically smart decision created by luck. (As they do give some absolutely hilarious stories to talk about!)

    I posted it over in the Help & Support forum, and they said that it is essentially fixed barring testing, although it would be pretty cool to create maps with water cities.

    I forgot to say that my first map was with 4 players and the second was with 2, both with standard setting and no underground.

    Your tests seem to point to a coincidence. I was surprised though, as the two maps were similar on this matter (player one on a big island with dragon/undead dwelling, and faery dwelling nearby, like 3 days far).

    So I did some more testing (not remotely thorough enough, but there was some sort of a pattern). The number of dwellings appears to depend primarily on the number of players and the map size (obviously), all other things default.

    For all Large maps with 6 players, there were no dwellings at all, but when dropped to 4 players on a large map, there were precisely 3 dwellings on each map.

    For Medium maps, the case is similar. If there are 4 players, there was on average <1 dwelling, But if there were only two players, then there were exactly 3 dwellings each time.

    For small maps with two players, there usually seemed to be only one dwelling.

    Sometimes the dwellings ended up fairly close to throne cities, but this seemed to be a coincidence as it didn’t happen very frequently.

    DISCLAIMER: This is all just pattern recognition and speculation from a VERY small sample for such a complex map generator. Take with a grain spoonful of salt

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