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jakjak 7 years, 9 months ago.
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I thought it would help some more to differentiate heroes based on their race if there were certain abilities that only heroes of a specific race could learn.
Examples:
High Elf:
Forest Guide(Party gains Forestry)Goblin:
Swamp Dweller(Party gains Wetland Foraging)
(Inflict) Disgusting StenchHalflings:
Minor Bard SkillsWell, you get the idea. They could be based on the race’s current race bonusses, or something wider. I think it wouldn’t be that hard to implement, and it’ll make a nice difference if I get a Goblin Hero instead of an elf one, where currently only the Class really matters.
unfortunately, group movement abilities don’t work with the current AI (last I was told) so you’d have to not do that.
Otherwise, they are a good idea for the new 10 levels, which now are somewhat lacking in content.
I wouldn’t make it entirely class independent, though: you don’t want sorcerers and warlords to start to blend together.
As an example, lets take a Goblin hero, and run through hypothetical ideas for abilities that are both gobliny and class appropriate.
For the Goblin dreadnought, they could get the trash catapult ability (with weaken).
As a Goblin Archdruid, they could get “Acid Strike”, which would give every unit in the stack with an active poison damage channel +2 fire damage.
A Goblin warlord could get “pointy party” where every melee strike on a target causes the attacker to get five melee damage.
A goblin rouge could get “gremlin hands” where all units do extra melee damage to machine/armored units and have a chance to stun machines.
A goblin theocrat could have an ability, “Blessing of the host” that would grant a morale and defense/resistance buff to a unit proportional to the number of friendly troops on the battlefield (since goblins move in larger numbers than others).
A goblin sorcerer could get an ability, “Poison Familiar” that would allow it to have an upkeep free lesser blight elemental that can evolve into a Blight Elemental. It would only be able to be cast once, unless the unit dies. However, you’d have to start over with a lesser one.
That would be the direction of my thoughts on racial hero abilities.
unfortunately, group movement abilities don’t work with the current AI (last I was told) so you’d have to not do that.
I did enjoy the party-Free Movement on my Druid heroes… Alas, apparently the AI calculates movement for units as a group, but functionally moves them individually(albeit with the appearance of a group), such that AI groups with such a leader would result in the party leader outpacing the group that planned to move the the same destination, until the rest of the party suddenly found itself without Free Movement after all.
Or something like that. I can’t recall the specifics properly.
This reminds me of this thread:
http://ageofwonders.com/forums/topic/unique-skills-for-each-hero/
On heroes having different types I aprove, Charge is a wasted ability on some Heroes like Sorcerers or Theocrats, and not to mention that it could create some interesting synergies with different classes on command. The only classes that benefit Heroes at the moment are the Warlord and the Dreadnought, and even so Martial Arts can be a bit underwhelming if the Hero is not built as a melee fighter.
Instead of all being all Cavalry, their types could be:
Warlord – Cavalry
Dreadnought – Cavalry
Sorcerer – Support
Theocrat – Support
Archdruid – Support or Archer
Rogue – IrregularAs for unique abilities that remindes me about that promise I made on that thread above, of revising the trait idea I suggested. Thinking now, I think that it would be a bit more simpler (and maybe fun) to have the Leader/Hero creation similar to what we had in AoW1, with lots of different abilities to choose independent of class or race.
This reminds me of this thread:
http://ageofwonders.com/forums/topic/unique-skills-for-each-hero/
On heroes having different types I aprove, Charge is a wasted ability on some Heroes like Sorcerers or Theocrats, and not to mention that it could create some interesting synergies with different classes on command. The only classes that benefit Heroes at the moment are the Warlord and the Dreadnought, and even so Martial Arts can be a bit underwhelming if the Hero is not built as a melee fighter.
Instead of all being all Cavalry, their types could be:
Warlord – Cavalry<br>
Dreadnought – Cavalry<br>
Sorcerer – Support<br>
Theocrat – Support<br>
Archdruid – Support or Archer<br>
Rogue – IrregularAs for unique abilities that remindes me about that promise I made on that thread above, of revising the trait idea I suggested. Thinking now, I think that it would be a bit more simpler (and maybe fun) to have the Leader/Hero creation similar to what we had in AoW1, with lots of different abilities to choose independent of class or race.
Also Ideas I like, even though I was hoping for something that would have some more chance to actually be implemented.
@Crys
Ik kinda like those ideas. My plan was to just add these abilities, and leave the current class abilities (nearly) untouched, as I still feel class should be more important than race.
Good thinking imho, ideas to make race more entertaining are almost always good :).
You could make some of these idea as simple as morale changes, e.g. Goblin leader = extra happiness in that stack for Goblins.
Small changes are easier to implement and race sadly is a rather underwhelming factor about heroes. Dwarf heroes are always better than similar human heroes for example.
But it think given how pivotal heroes are in AoW, the do deserve more than that.
@BBB: Or maybe as a general mechanic: Units in the leaders army with the same race as the leader get +100 morale, or something like that.
And racials, something like an Elf hero gaining a minor healing (because, y’know, elves and magical healing and stuff), Human hero being able to learn “Tactics” (I’d say that complex tactics are a bit of a human trait) that gives the full party +4 in-combat movement speed, etc would be nice too. Maybe best would be 3-4 learn-able abilities per race, so you have some real differences. It would diverse the game a lot, I think.
Ik kinda like those ideas. My plan was to just add these abilities, and leave the current class abilities (nearly) untouched, as I still feel class should be more important than race.
I agree, and I think there is a place for both kinds of things: class additional things, and some generic racial ones. I just think it would be neat if the ultimate class type things had some racial flavor. Sort of along the lines that a super master type is the one who gets to put a personalized touch on the abilities.
You could make some of these idea as simple as morale changes, e.g. Goblin leader = extra happiness in that stack for Goblins.
one of the “soft synergies” of older discussions?
+1 for more racial hero differences they all feel the same if they got the same class (except halflings because they are 2-hit heroes but that is another thing) few races are just useless in some combinations (halfling warlord for example). I like chrys ideas but I think they should come quite early (maybe one on level 1 then on level 5, 8 and 13 the next) so that the racial traits don’t just are there on level 25 or so (never had a hero above lvl 15)
I can’t think of specific abilities now. I will post them here if I can think of some.I like chrys ideas but I think they should come quite early (maybe one on level 1 then on level 5, 8 and 13 the next) so that the racial traits don’t just are there on level 25 or so (never had a hero above lvl 15)
the problem with putting them in early is that they’ll either displace class abilities, or be ignored if they aren’t better. The early set of upgrades and such is fairly well balanced as is, and you’d have to totally redesign that part of the game and add new material for the extra 10 levels.
I’d rather leave what is working alone, and put stuff in a new area.
Nevertheless, a single minor racially differentiated ability wouldn’t be too bad at the start. Like in Skyrim, how every race has a minor spell/ability.
also halfling warlords are amazing, since the stat upgrades mitigate the weaknesses, and the morale boosting works great with luck.
How about the racial ones being on par with class ones but opening up stronger options later (if that is possible, so far I know of no hero trait that requires another except for the stat boosts).
For example goblins:
Level 5 – 20% Blight resistance
Level 11 – Inflict Poison
Level 17 – Disgusting Stench
Level 19 – Army gets wetland and cave concealment
Level 23 – +4 blight damage on all attacksThis idea has been a long time coming I feel, and with the last patch it struck me as even more vital. For instance, a rogue goblin has his spiffy cool sexy assassins now that have swamp concealment, but now he can’t go with them on raids! With this in mind, I feel that 2 new categories of abilities should be added to heroes: Racial, and Hybrid.
Racial is simple stuff, like the option for a human to, upon hitting level 6, gain swimming. Humans should also gain Bestow Iron Heart as an option. Goblins should be able to get the ability to fire mosquitoes like a swarm darter at level 7-9. Elves should be able to gain inflict shock at very high levels. Draconians should get fire bombs, and maybe flying at 15.
Hybrid stuff is essentially only available to that specific class and race combination. For example, human druids and human rogues totally need water concealment as an option now. Ditto goblins rogues and goblin druids on swamps. Why shouldn’t human dreadnoughts and warlords get the option to get shielded and maybe even devout if they so desired so they can basically gain knight traits. A dwarven warlord should have the option to get a fire aura and fire strike. How about orc warlords with polearm? Or even early access to killing momentum? What if around level 11 elven warlords got phase?
Alrighty I’m done with stupid ideas now.
… I feel that 2 new categories of abilities should be added to heroes: Racial, and Hybrid.
+1 for this!
I suggested this a while ago lol there could be a few spells or empire upgrades (just a couple) as well I dont think I like the idea of changing hero types to support etc however I like the nuetrality of a fresh hero/leader
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