Shadow Realm – closed beta tests

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Home Forums Modding and Map Making Shadow Realm – closed beta tests

This topic contains 43 replies, has 8 voices, and was last updated by  Hiliadan 3 years, 9 months ago.

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  • #280050

    Hiliadan
    Member

    Most of the things that were planned for the Shadow Realm expansion have been implemented during the alpha phase. In June, the closed beta phase started. The aims of this new phase should be to:
    – finish the last bits that need to be designed or polished
    – improve balance
    – test the compatibility of the expansion with other mods and adjust things to increase compatibility

    Some parts are a bit less advanced than others, in particular the RMG still needs some work, and the campaign’s second and third scenario are still at the design stage.

    The “public Wiki” page was updated to help beta testers understand the content of the expansion: http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Hiliadan/Shadow_Realm_Community_Expansion_Content

    This thread is here to collect feedback on balance and bug reports. Please check the 2nd post for known issues.

    #280051

    Hiliadan
    Member

    WARNING:
    – when generating a new random map after having switched on or off the expansion, please reset the settings to default, otherwise you may experience crashes.
    – if you create Shadow Elf custom Leaders, you’ll have to delete them if you want to switch off the expansion and use custom Leaders again, otherwise you’ll get crashes.

    These 2 issues should be fixed by devs in a later patch of AoW3.

    A list of all the bugs fixed during alpha can be found here: http://aow.triumph.net/forums/topic/shadow-realm-alpha-tests/#post-258272

    List updated on 26 August 2018:

    Bugs and major things to correct
    DEVS – if you created a custom Shadow Elf hero with the mods activated and you try to go to the “Custom” tab during Leader selection without the mods activated, it crashes AoW3 (was tested for a live MP game but I guess that applies to any game)
    DEVS – Switching the RMG mod ON or OFF consistently crash the game whenever you try to generate new random maps. See http://aow.triumph.net/forums/topic/crash-when-generating-a-map-after-deactivating-a-mod-adding-a-new-layer/
    Model – the Harvester needs to be re-rigged in the .clb or re-weight-painted in Maya
    RMG – Rare crash upon generation
    RMG – The Archons spawning on the SR layer are only Undead instead of living Archons (+ Undead Archons)
    Model – Elf-based replacements for the male hero bodies are required
    RMG – Shadow Gates can spawn on water on the surface layer (water hex and surrounded by water hexes; they should spawn like normal Cave Entrance on land)
    RMG – isolated road triangles and other shapes (including isolated hexes) are generated in the Shadow Realm, cf. screenshot: https://www.my-league.com/games/273/downloads/screens/47398/273/152041668120180307_2nd-alpha-test_turn4_Shadow-Realm-void.jpg
    RMG – Warband Campfire are not generated by the RMG (on the Shadow layer)
    – when using only Decodence Map Editor Content + Shadow Realm (and also when adding Decodence RMG Integration as 3rd mod), which should allow to play the expansion without the Shadow layer, the game crashes when a map is generated if you try to play with a Shadow Elf Leader, giving the error: [10:57:53][ERROR]Assertion failed: “lPlayerRace != 0”
    – Shadow Artifact does not cause -1/-1/-1 to non-Shadow Walkers OUTSIDE the Shadow Realm (it should give them -1/-1/-1 but NOT on the Shadow Realm as it does not stack with Vulnerable to Shadow Sickness, and it should affect only non-Shadow Walkers)
    RMG – Missing the following sites on the Shadow layer: Raven Home, Sword of the Ashen Rose, Castle of the Lich King, Maelstrom
    RMG – Several sites have very high densities and are concentrated in cluster, and even worse, they’re near starting cities: Forgotten Thrones, Archon Fort
    RMG – The RMG generates a lot of Void, and just links cities together with roads but that creates vast areas of empty space. It should not be possible to move for 3 turns without anything to clear.

    RMG – Starting cities can have crazy income in their vicinity (and a lot of site duplicates), as illustrated by this screenshot

    RMG – Foundry (from Decodence), Gold Mine and Magma Forge are spawning on the Shadow layer, they should not
    RMG – Archon (living) Dwellings are not spawning on the Shadow layer
    RMG – Gold Mines can spawn with Temperate climate below them on the Shadow Realm, see

    Intermediate issues
    – the (SR) Ancient Ruins does not display the MCU in its description. They aren’t displayed because the Shadow Realm versions of these structures don’t unlock the MCUs right now, a MCU can only be linked to one structure and they’re already linked to the regular versions of these structures. So a solution needs to be found.
    – Shadow Weed Decoction never appears in the research book (it should)
    – the values for the Forgotten Thrones need to be updated: item multiplier: 0.6; skill multiplier: 5; excess reward scale: 0.5, cf. (updated) https://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Forgotten_Throne

    Minor issues
    – when generating map, there is sometimes a “cannot randomize alignment” issue, as below:
    [23:56:03]RMG Structure Settings: Shadow Realm (Structure)
    [23:56:03]RMG Zone Settings: Underground (Zones)
    [23:56:03]RMG Terrain Settings: Underground (Terrain)
    [23:56:03]RMG Structure Settings: Underground (Structure)
    [23:56:03]Heap: RMG Heap – Leaking memory! (Allocations left: 491)
    [23:57:03]Report for heap RMG Heap:
    [23:57:03]max system bytes = 4128768
    [23:57:03]system bytes = 4128768
    [23:57:03]in use bytes = 2883816
    [23:57:03][STATE -] SYSTEM: GAME_LOBBY
    [23:57:04][STATE +] SYSTEM: GAME_OPEN
    [23:57:04]Opening Game Session
    [23:57:04]Game Session – Setup
    [23:57:05]Game Session – Load
    [23:57:05]Game Session – Open
    [23:57:05]===============================================================
    [23:57:05]Setting random seed 0x03be49d3
    [23:57:05]===============================================================
    [23:57:05][ERROR][WORLD_ACTIVATE]Cannot randomize alignment for independent city
    [23:57:05][ERROR][WORLD_ACTIVATE]Cannot randomize alignment for independent city
    [23:57:05][ERROR][WORLD_ACTIVATE]Assertion failed: “false”

    [23:57:06]Message: [WORLD_ACTIVATE]Meandor’s nam
    – there are two Mithril Mines in the Map Editor: shouldn’t we have only 1? 1 is from Decodence so is the other one a duplicate for the SR Expansion?
    – the icon of the Gemstone Mine, Mithril Mine Flame of Gauth, Sword of the Ashen Rose have not an appropriate alpha layer so a black square surrounds it
    – Gemstone Mines http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Gemstone_Mine are not properly described, they appear as Gold Mine, with a Gold Mine description
    – Infused and Night Guard: we’ve got an issue with their model, it has an armor but the unit doesn’t have Armored. Not sure what we should do. Easiest would be to remove the armor maybe? Depending on how the model is done, should be do-able in the mod tool?
    – the Shadow Demon Larva has no entry on the ToW (I guess I missed where it was set so didn’t reproduce it)
    – Lightning Sprites “Static Discharge“ is by default in “attack mode” and cannot be used as “move and attack“
    – Archon Dwelling’s buildings do not have their right name: https://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Hiliadan/Living_Archon#Buildings
    – the ToW entry for the Archon Dwelling is called “Dwelling: Necropolis […]” and should be renamed. It is empty below: “Can Produce the following units”, it should list the (living) Archon units
    Model – Exterminators’ sword should be red (full of blood, see their description)
    – Lightning Sprite should not be affected by Call Forth Darkness and Invoke Darkness (this is a change decided on 13/07)
    – the Shadow Elf city and fortress names and the Archon Dwelling names might not be linked: to confirm, see ShadowElves_CityNames.xml in the Dropbox.
    – all Shadow Gates should be called “Shadow Gate” and not “Shadow Gate Teleporter”. Shadow Weeds should be called Shadow Weed.
    – Vulnerable to Shadow Sickness displayed for Undeads (Reanimators, Lost Souls) whereas it shouldn’t. They should have Shadow Walker. [they still miss Shadow Walker, so do Dragons]
    – the Lightning Sprite’s medal bonus do not match the Wikia: http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Lightning_Sprite A property showing the number of turns it has left before dying should be displayed. [the property is still not displayed]
    – Strong Will Slayer’s description lacks the icon for the physical damage
    – Resource_CrystalMine.clb needs to be renamed Resource_GemstoneMine.clb and the link in the .rpk modified accordingly.
    The issue in the log: “[15:10:59][ERROR][WORLD_ACTIVATE]Animation component activated for an entity Gemstone Mine with a model (Crystal Mine- Not Claimed) with no rig” can be solved by removing the “Animation” in Entities/Components (for the Gold Mine’s animation to work, the Gemstone Mine would need to use the same rig but that’s impossible, I tested in the .clb, some bones are different).
    – the errors in the log:
    [15:11:04][ERROR][WORLD_ACTIVATE][SCRIPTING ERROR] Error in line number 3. Message was:
    [15:11:07][ERROR][WORLD_ACTIVATE] [string “”]:3: attempt to index field ‘STRUCT_GLOW’ (a nil value)
    – the (Undead) Archon Titan needs to be renamed “Undead Archon Titan”
    – Shadow Demon Slayer doesn’t have the damage type icon in the description.
    – Draconian’s ToW entry do not list they have Shadow Walker
    – Celestial Pool has a button reading “Undefined: Trigger” on the strategic map. It should not have any button (it’s not a Well of Soul, the effect should happen when you go over the site, like a Shrine).
    – Shadow Elf Apprentice’s Dispel Magic and Shadow Fire icon display in tactical combat should be switched: Dispel Magic in #7 and Shadow Fire in #2 (it’s currently the opposite)
    – the Shadow Elf ability’s icon is too big (my fault): it needs to be linked to the icon at X=0, Y=0 in Shadow Elves Racial Units.dds instead of the Shadow Elves Race Icon.dds’ icon

    Other “to do”
    – Add a description for the entry of Vulnerable to Shadow Sickness listed as an Avatar Empire Upgrade in the ToW: this is what gives everyone (except Shadow Walkers) Vulnerable to Shadow Sickness), Shadow Sickness work.
    – test Disrupt Magical Form and Call Forth Darkness
    – Divine Vengeance renamed Dark Vengeance, for or against? I don’t think it’s necessary.
    – See what we do with bridge tactical maps on Tundra which are lacking their bridges
    – decide whether Shadow Demons should be valid targets for Convert, Charm, Seduce
    – work on the “to do” for the Archons: https://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Hiliadan/Living_Archon#Additional_ideas and how to get Shadow Demons under control, see https://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Hiliadan/Shadow_Realm_Community_Expansion#Shadow_Demons
    – add the changes to the Archons in the changes to the base game: rename the Archon Titan, update the ToW entry of Archons
    – Infused have Armoured, but the flavour text says they are unarmoured.

    Recent fixes (available on the 26 August update), need to be checked
    RMG – at map generation, the following error are displayed:
    [00:02:59]Setting up Host
    [00:02:59]Generating new GameID
    [00:02:59]KeepAlive sent..
    [00:02:59]Generating random level with seed: 2608824013.
    [00:03:00]RMG Zone Settings: Land (Zones)
    [00:03:00]RMG Terrain Settings: Land (Terrain)
    [00:03:00]RMG Structure Settings: Land (Structure)
    [00:03:00]RMG Zone Settings: Shadow Realm (Zones)
    [00:03:00]RMG Terrain Settings: Shadow Realm (Terrain)
    [00:03:00]RMG Structure Settings: Shadow Realm (Structure)
    [00:03:00][ERROR]Assertion failed: “pType!=NULL”
    [00:03:35]Message: Can’t assign a NULL type!
    [00:03:35]d:\source.aow.gog\creator\gc\source\hexworld\materialworld\GCMaterialHexCellData.cpp(155): (click to open)

    [00:03:35]
    [00:03:35][ERROR]Assertion failed: “false”
    [00:04:29]Message: Meandor’s n
    RMG – Cristal Mines from Decodence have been added to the SR layer instead of Gemstone Mines

    RMG – maybe a side-effect of Decodence RMG Integration but it’s now possible to get 2 Magma Forge in a 5 hexes radius of your Throne (surface start). It never happens in normal games.
    – the effect of the Shadow Weed is displayed as “Shadow Weed Decoction” in blue. The visit site can only give a “property”, not a “requisite” so it cannot be “Shadow Walker” and it can’t make units immune to Shadow Artifact (outside the SR layer). “Shadow Weed Decoction” is already the name of a spell, so we need to find another name. ==> Shadow Weed should now give Lesser Shadow Walker.
    – Spawn Larva acts as Greater Reanimate Undead (brings back the dead unit) instead of acting as Raise Corpse but with Larva instead of Cadaver
    – Static Discharge seems to be considered a melee attack, should be Touch/ranged (to avoid getting Panicked due to a Fearsome Shadow Demon Lord for instance!! 😀 or if possible the first effect should be Touch – so can get Panicked – but the jump should be ranged and not possible to get Panicked)
    – Summon Lightning Sprite does not show blue hexes for valid targets (all adjacent hexes). A possible solution would be to make it move and use, similar to other touch-range abilities where the unit automatically moves to get in range of the ability
    – the T3 building unlocks both, should unlock only the Chariot one
    – the chariot Umbral Weaver has 2 figures on the tactical map, instead of 1
    – the Bombard ability directly gives “Infected” to the unit on the central hex instead of triggering “Inflict Infected” with a blight check
    – Celestrial Tower (MCU) lacks the damage description (” … deals 20 to a single enemy unit“)
    – the 2 Umbral Weavers have the same name in game, while waiting for a new name (“Foot Umbral Weaver”??… :D), I suggest to rename the new one “Umbral Weaver Chariot” as a temporary name.
    – Larva Pool: the Excess use mod is apparently set on gold instead of mana http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Larva_Pool
    – SE Builder is missing the Build Water Fortress ability.
    – (living) Archon Dwellings do not have their minor race name displayed, e.g. in the diplomacy screen, it’s displayed “(null) (Neutral)” instead of “Archon (Neutral)”
    RMG – the Shadow Realm is between the UG and Surface when you click on the arrows on the mini map to switch between layers. That would seem more logical for it to be above Surface
    – Shadow Artifact gives Shadow Sickness to Undeads (“Shadow Sickness” appears in their unit panel) even if in the end, they do not get affected by its effect (no -1/-1/-1)
    – Forgotten Throne do not give any reward despite reward sets apparently being in the mod tool https://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Forgotten_Throne Is it because they are “Terrain Painting” structure type like Hearts instead of a Treasure Site?

    To design
    – Wicked Flame of Ghrauth could have a better description, it’s not clear what the reward is by looking at the description.
    – update the description of Shadow Shift in the Wikia: it doesn’t last until end of round but only for the turn of the unit (so available in attack but not defense)
    – Sword of the Ashen Rose to add in the Wikia
    – A description of the Shadow Elf race (in the style “they are violent and multiply very quickly” etc. like for other races) to add to the Wikia and their ToW entry. + Shrine of Storms and Lightning Cannon
    – new defender sets need to be designed for Mana Nodes, Crystal Tree, Flowrock Quarry, Forbidden Sanctum, Tomb, Vault of Knowledge, Wizard Tower Ruins

    Balance discussion
    – Should SE Martyrs cost +5 Mana and/or have 11 shock ranged damage, as Human Martyrs are at 11 spirit ranged damage and cost +5 Mana?
    – Move Sprint to Elite for Touched.
    – SE Arcane Archers should probably have 7 def as they don’t have Armored like HE Longbowman who have 8 def (Flamers also have 7 without Armored, Harpoon Throwers have 8 without Armored)

    Checked and fixed
    – Shadow Elf cities give High Elves instead of Shadow Elves as rewards
    – SE Apprentice: a bit like Succubi, the Wiki says Fairy Fire, not Shadow Fire, so should be switched back to Fairy Fire. Medals need to be reverted to Fairy Fire ones too.
    – SE Bards lack Shadow Walker Aura: http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Bard And Inflict Shadow Sickness should be removed from them.
    – Gemstone Mine: incorrect defender set (Undead Archon instead of http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Gemstone_Mine)
    – the description and name of the Lightning Prayer Bolts of the Shrine of Storms are swapped
    – Shadow Weed is still called Haste Berries with the description of the Haste Berries? I see many patches of it on the SR and they don’t regen MP but instead give Shadow Weed Decoction.
    – Lacking this part of the description of Glass Furnace:
    Fully restores the Health Text of visiting Machine Machine.
    * Replenishes in 4 Turns
    Unlocks: Glass Armory.
    – SE Succubi should have 10 physical, 3 shock melee damage. They have Invoke Darkness instead of Call Forth Darkness. The difference is that Call Forth Darkness also gives -100 happiness and is cooldown 2 instead of cooldown 1. Also Dark Pact gives them Shadow Fire instead of Fairy Fire (Shadow Fire was mentioned only once by Dr_K on p.19 of the Shadow Realm topic http://aow.triumph.net/forums/topic/shadow-realm-brainstorm/page/19/#post-250658 but it was not really agreed on)
    – Strong Will Slayer’s description does not mention the additional damage: http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Strong_Will_Slayer
    – Inflict Break Body and Soul’s description does not say that Broken does not affect Machines and Undeads: http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Broken
    – Fire Lightning Bolt cannot be used on enemy unit directly, you have to shoot a hex infront of them to attack them.
    – Call Forth Darkness lacks a proper information on the strength of the check on Blind http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Call_Forth_Darkness
    RMG – there is a zoom issue in the SR. The zoom is weird by default but if you zoom in, it goes below the floor of the map, see screenshot: https://www.my-league.com/games/273/downloads/screens/47398/273/151578090720180113_zoom-bug-on-SR.jpg When not playing in debug mode, this zoom bug in the Shadow Realm layer causes a crash to the game. Especially in a high graphics setting.
    It also crashes in debug mode, and throws the following error a huge number (x200) of times: [00:09:45][ERROR]AllocateShader failed[ERROR]AllocateShader failed[ERROR]AllocateShader failed[ERROR]AllocateShader failed[ERROR]AllocateShader failed[ERROR]AllocateShader failed[ERROR]Assertion failed: “false”
    RMG – Archon (living) Dwellings do not spawn on the SR, others Dwellings also do not spawn (0 on a Medium Land map)
    RMG – RMG generates too many Forbidden Sanctums on the Shadow layer, see screenshot
    RMG – Merfolk Dwelling can spawn on land on the Shadow Realm layer (should spawn on water with enough water area around it). It can then be guarded by landlocked units.
    RMG – Shadow Elves do not by default start on the Shadow layer
    RMG – Shadow Gates can spawn just next to starting city (I got one 2 hexes away from my Throne), that’s too close, it should be as far as Cave Entrances in the official version
    RMG – (living) Archon Dwellings spawn outside the Shadow Realm (surface, UG)
    RMG – Beacon of Light and Heart of Shadows are not on RMG maps
    RMG – the Larva Pool does not spawn in the RMG
    – When a game is loaded, all the Shadow Elf leaders are displayed in the log through this error:
    [11:34:24][ERROR][WORLD_ACTIVATE]Cannot find Hero Figure Media Dictionary found for: Mount: MOUNT_WYVERN, Race: Shadow Elf, Class: Necromancer, Gender: 2
    [11:34:24][ERROR][WORLD_ACTIVATE]Cannot find Hero Figure Media Dictionary found for: Mount: MOUNT_WYVERN, Race: Shadow Elf, Class: Sorcerer, Gender: 1
    – when a tactical map is loaded with a SE hero, the following error is displayed (if it’s a Theocrat):
    [11:37:04][ERROR]Cannot find Hero Figure Media Dictionary found for: Mount: MOUNT_WYVERN, Race: Shadow Elf, Class: Theocrat, Gender: 1
    – the description of Chaos should be clarified to make it clear Taunted is 100% success, maybe as in the Wikia: http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Chaos
    – Shadow Demon Larva can’t be used in game due to lack of icon
    – in the .rpk where the icons of SE are defined, the following things need to be renamed: the Storm Priest’s icon needs to be removed (it uses one of the 2 Archer icons); the Weaver’s icon needs to be renamed Storm Priest’s icon; the Exterminator’s icon needs to be renamed Weaver’s icon (we don’t have an icon for Exterminators yet)
    – Archon units lack their description: https://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Hiliadan/Living_Archon#Units

    • This reply was modified 3 years, 11 months ago by  Hiliadan.
    • This reply was modified 3 years, 11 months ago by  Hiliadan.
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    #280160

    HousePet
    Member

    Well I’m getting a small issue. It isn’t generating a Shadow Realm layer. I’ve poked it in a few different ways, including noticing that my Decodence RMG integration wasn’t updating to the latest version. So I’ve now ensured both Decodence mods are up to date. I’m using the SR mods from the two .taf files in the Exported Mod Files folder. No other mods active. All I can see in the debug log that looks vaguely relevant is:
    [ERROR]Couldn’t parse decodentabilities@decodence and theme in rmg@charlatan
    [ERROR]Couldn’t parse decodentabilities@structures in rmg@gloweye
    Was there something I needed to do to get it to generate a shadow realm layer?

    Other than that, I can confirm that Shadow Elf city quests are now giving Shadow Elf units.
    ToW says that SE Succubi have Call Forth Darkness.
    ToW says that SE Bards have Shadow Walker Aura, but I haven’t tested it.

    Other notes (which probably repeat many already known things):
    I really like the flavour texts on the units that have them so far. 🙂
    Other than a completely missing Shadow Layer, I haven’t had any crashes or obvious errors.
    Icons obviously need a big clean up and we need a ton of new icons. All the unit icons have incorrect alpha channels set.
    Shadow Elves have a very diverse range of skin tones. Light teal, dark teal, some that look like High Elves, others that look more like Syrons? The leader/hero skin tone is lighter than I expected. Also Kyridarion the Shielder appears to have normal elf skin tone.
    Many SE units just seem to glow for no reason. Shadow Realm crystal equipment glowing is fine, but some units appear to have glowing skin.
    Exterminators do not have red swords (flavour text says they still use blood red swords). <Major Bug!> 😛
    I think a few SE units should have Forestry, since that is the races favourite terrain. Scouts, Touched, Monster Hunters and Scoundrel come to mind.
    Does anything have Shadow Running? I would expect at least SE Scouts to have it.
    I suspect Lightning Sprites are not working as intended. Getting them into melee range and having a full turn of movement to use Static Discharge seems almost impossible. Not sure the cooldown on summoning them should be 1 turn, but that really depends on how useful they are when they are working properly.
    Also, Invoke/Call Forth Shadows will hit Lightning Sprites, which is a bit of an unexpected antisynergy between Support units.
    No SE starts with Exploit Shadows and only a few gain it at Elite, with 1? getting it at Veteran. That seems way to rare to use. Not sure a complex combo mechanic that only adds a little extra damage should be locked behind a RG upgrade.
    Something wrong with the city name list? I ended up with more than one city called Allassa.
    Should Call Forth/Invoke Darkness be Frost and Blight, rather than Frost and Physical? And do we really need two similar abilities?

    Edit: I had a couple of underground starts with no structures around my starting city. I think something is broken somewhere.

    • This reply was modified 3 years, 11 months ago by  HousePet.
    • This reply was modified 3 years, 11 months ago by  HousePet.
    #280169

    Refineus
    Member

    Shadow Elves have a very diverse range of skin tones. Light teal, dark teal, some that look like High Elves, others that look more like Syrons? The leader/hero skin tone is lighter than I expected. Also Kyridarion the Shielder appears to have normal elf skin tone.

    As I understand most of the Shadow Elves have the same skin tone rooster as the High elves except for the really green one. I believe this section is quite under developed in terms of custimization. What I done is to variate the amount of lightning to make the leaders more unique and different. However, it still difficult to get the feeling of old dark elfs turned into shadowelves. I do not know if there are any future plans for leader custimization in near future for to increase the skin coulers, blue, dark green, purple, etc?

    #280170

    Hiliadan
    Member

    Good testing HousePet, many thanks! 🙂 Keep the feedback coming!

    Well I’m getting a small issue. It isn’t generating a Shadow Realm layer.

    You need to reset the RMG, as explained at the top of the 2nd post.

    ToW says that SE Succubi have Call Forth Darkness.
    ToW says that SE Bards have Shadow Walker Aura, but I haven’t tested it.

    Ok but that was not the whole thing that was fixed. There was also the attack of Succubi and the Inflict Shadow Sickness of the Bards. Is it fixed too?
    And thanks for checking the fixes, that’s a very important work and unfortunately we lack people to do it. So if you could help with that, that’d be super useful.

    Shadow Elves have a very diverse range of skin tones. Light teal, dark teal, some that look like High Elves, others that look more like Syrons? The leader/hero skin tone is lighter than I expected. Also Kyridarion the Shielder appears to have normal elf skin tone.

    Shadow Elf male heroes / Leaders do not have their appropriate skins. We need the help of vfxrob to provide these.

    Exterminators do not have red swords (flavour text says they still use blood red swords). <Major Bug!> 😛

    Ok, I note that for vfxrob too.

    I think a few SE units should have Forestry, since that is the races favourite terrain. Scouts, Touched, Monster Hunters and Scoundrel come to mind.
    Does anything have Shadow Running? I would expect at least SE Scouts to have it.

    Balance-wise, I’m not convinced at all. They already have a lot of strengths (no Shadow Sickness, +2 resistance, only access to Tame Shadow Demon…).
    Scouts never get specific race bonus so I’d be against. Touched are already OP.
    Monster Hunters and Scoundrels also never get movement bonus that are not racial bonus (like Forestry that ALL High Elves have).

    I suspect Lightning Sprites are not working as intended. Getting them into melee range and having a full turn of movement to use Static Discharge seems almost impossible. Not sure the cooldown on summoning them should be 1 turn, but that really depends on how useful they are when they are working properly.

    It’s working as designed but it’s indeed possible the design was bad. I don’t have enough experience playing them yet to say. But I’m not sure they need a boost. It’s actually not that hard to get Static Discharge to be used and having a Sprite can make fights significantly easier vs the AI. If we were to boost the Sprite summon, we should nerf the normal range attack IMO.

    Also, Invoke/Call Forth Shadows will hit Lightning Sprites, which is a bit of an unexpected antisynergy between Support units.

    Yeah, good point, I’m editing the Wikia to make Sprite unaffected and adding it in the list of thing to correct.

    No SE starts with Exploit Shadows and only a few gain it at Elite, with 1? getting it at Veteran. That seems way to rare to use. Not sure a complex combo mechanic that only adds a little extra damage should be locked behind a RG upgrade.

    They are balanced to be played without the additional +3 damage. Making it more accessible would make them OP. And it’s actually very easy to get to Veteran and quite easy to get to Elite. The RG is not necessary to use the Exploit Shadows.

    Something wrong with the city name list? I ended up with more than one city called Allassa.

    This is weird because Allassa is not in the list for SE. The list is this:
    Auronia
    Ballagor
    Cyndring
    Danlasakrator
    Eravinzor
    Flynzer
    Gafradryn
    Honura
    Kryslon
    Limaga
    Mystror
    Navela
    Nikrano
    Oktalton
    Omdor
    Rakelan
    Ravela
    Razoron
    Ripyra
    Ropeda
    Rugor
    Russor
    Sagen
    Sakera
    Savion
    Sedron
    Shiron
    Sindera
    Soharia
    Sororana
    Sunlor
    Suvola
    Syford
    Taleen
    Tanken
    Tavros
    Teband
    Tedror
    Telvenda
    Tilso
    Tramcoria
    Vinstar
    Wector
    Wylvor
    Xymor
    Yаflоn
    Yоror
    Zambar
    Zeldon
    Zandria
    Zankre Zalar

    These are fortresses:
    Abatorn
    Avalor
    Bandera
    Demagor
    Drenkar
    Efolorn
    Emardal
    Estor
    Frenskara
    Fulkard
    Gerom
    Hivalla
    Menstone
    Orvan
    Postas
    Prendor
    Pylsar
    Ralana
    Reffer
    Relixs
    Rinank
    Ronban
    Ruutelar
    Spinder
    Svandi
    Trenzoria
    Ydro Meala
    Zios
    Zjenker
    Zjoliria

    These are Archons:
    Achyanir
    Amboyalia
    Astralior
    Bykrona
    Churcham
    Delsor
    Endram
    Ekropral
    Fuxborg
    Gvinst
    Imeras
    Jahnir
    Konalstonaria
    Lumaniar
    Marsta
    Palas Kira
    Senter
    Splindyr
    Standerdam
    Voltsor

    I’m not sure they’re implemented. I add it to the list of minor bugs to check.

    Should Call Forth/Invoke Darkness be Frost and Blight, rather than Frost and Physical? And do we really need two similar abilities?

    Why is that? We said Shadow damage was Shock and Frost.

    Edit: I had a couple of underground starts with no structures around my starting city. I think something is broken somewhere.

    Mmh, that’s weird. If it happens again, please take screenshots.

    #280173

    Bob5
    Member

    One thing about the Lightning Sprites, they’re not very powerful, they’re fragile like Wisps but without the stunning or teleporting that Wisps can do. Static Discharge can be tricky to use as you need 3 action points and it’s melee range only. If enemies are in that range chances are they already attacked your Sprites and you lost action points in retaliation, while if they didn’t attack you they’re usually not in green range to hit. So in practice it is quite situational.

    That said, they do function reasonably well as free meat shields that you can summon at the start of battle. Lightning Sprites are decent in taking hits that you don’t want your other units to take. It’s a little trick the Storm Priests can do, it’s their equivalent to other supports getting healing options or buffs like Dragon Ancestry. Lightning Sprites are also somewhat of a high priority for the AI to target as I think their Static Discharge counts as an AoE attack which is higher priority for the AI. They’re excellent in distracting enemy units when clearing because they’re so expendable, especially for PBEM I think they’re good enough.

    – the effect of the Shadow Weed is displayed as “Shadow Weed Decoction” in blue. The visit site can only give a “property”, not a “requisite” so it cannot be “Shadow Walker” and it can’t make units immune to Shadow Artifact (outside the SR layer). “Shadow Weed Decoction” is already the name of a spell, so we need to find another name.

    If I recall correctly Shadow Weeds should give Lesser Shadow Walking in the current (end of June) build.

    – Spawn Larva acts as Greater Reanimate Undead (brings back the dead unit) instead of acting as Raise Corpse but with Larva instead of Cadaver

    I’m pretty sure I already fixed this. Do note that the popup before clicking on the corpse will display the name of the dead unit, I think Raise Corpse also does that, but it will resurrect as a Larva.

    #280175

    Hiliadan
    Member

    If enemies are in that range chances are they already attacked your Sprites and you lost action points in retaliation, while if they didn’t attack you they’re usually not in green range to hit. So in practice it is quite situational.

    It just requires to play it differently. I’ve managed to use several times.
    Overall, I think the SE are a harder race to play but with a very strong potential for experienced players. So it might be a bit tricky as casual players will find them underwhelming (as might live MP players who can’t play battles vs independents in manual), while veteran PBEM players will find them too strong.

    especially for PBEM I think they’re good enough.

    Yes, probably even better than that.

    #280183

    HousePet
    Member

    Yep the attack of the Succubi and the removal of Inflict Shadow Sickness from Bards is good. If I can trust the ToW, which I assume so since it is generated from the unit tables.

    Re Forestry and Irregulars:
    Happy to defer all unit balance decisions, as that really isn’t something I’m good with. However, both other races that like Dense Vegetation also get Forestry as innate. So for mechanical consistency and flavour it makes sense that all SE would have Forestry. But then since they also get Shadow Walker as a major unique ability I limited my suggestion to selected Irregular units only.
    I notice that the Tigran Cheetah unit does have Forestry not from a racial source.
    And Monster Hunter and Scoundrel units do occasionally get additional racial variations. I don’t think we need to be a strict as requiring a movement related precedent.
    Perhaps Infused could lose Sprint? Just throwing out ideas.
    Nice to see that all Monster Hunters get Shadow Demon Slayer.

    Re Lightning Sprites:
    Being able to summon them, and then later possibly using the difficult Static Discharge ability is possibly overcomplicated. I’m not sure they need something as complicated/powerful as the Static Discharge ability. But this is getting into unit balance, so I have no strong opinions here.

    Re Exploit Shadows:
    Units with Exploit Shadows:
    Elite Arcane Archer T1.
    Elite Nightguard T1.
    Veteran Phalanx T3 Warlord only.
    Getting the rank might not be hard. Finding units that actually get Exploit Shadows is a little harder.

    Re City Names:
    I had none of those names. I’m guessing the new list isn’t linked to the race.

    Re Invoke Darkness thingy:
    I probably forgot what we decided, and the “Darkness” in the name made me think of Black Bolts and Death Ray…

    I also forgot to mention that SE units have 3 hex sight above ground, but 4 hex sight below ground. This might be normal for other races and I haven’t noticed it before though. Okay, this is normal but its still weird. XD

    And an extra: SE Apprentices are back to Fairy Fire with the correct medal adjustments. Can’t check Succubi until I play a Rogue.

    #280186

    Hiliadan
    Member

    I notice that the Tigran Cheetah unit does have Forestry not from a racial source.
    And Monster Hunter and Scoundrel units do occasionally get additional racial variations. I don’t think we need to be a strict as requiring a movement related precedent.
    Perhaps Infused could lose Sprint? Just throwing out ideas.

    Yes, racial non-class units do get movement bonuses other units of their race don’t get. We could give Forestry to some racial units and maybe even to some class Irregulars, but it needs to be considered carefully. Let’s see if other people ask for it. 😛

    And yes, I do think Touched (I guess you meant Touched, not Infused?) should lose Sprint on Recruit as it’s clearly too strong. They could get it on Elite like Cheetah (and then they have it only during the fight where they get to it, before Evolving when back on the strategic map).

    Re Exploit Shadows:
    Units with Exploit Shadows:
    Elite Arcane Archer T1.
    Elite Nightguard T1.
    Veteran Phalanx T3 Warlord only.

    Assassins also.
    That might be too few indeed.

    #280189

    HousePet
    Member

    Yes I did mean Touched. I realised some time later while out walking…
    I’m now giving Meandor a test with a Shadow Realm layer.
    He’s lost a bit of weight…

    #280203

    Hiliadan
    Member

    A critical bug:
    – when using only Decodence Map Editor Content + Shadow Realm (and also when adding Decodence RMG Integration as 3rd mod), which should allow to play the expansion without the Shadow layer, the game crashes when a map is generated if you try to play with a Shadow Elf Leader, giving the error: [10:57:53][ERROR]Assertion failed: “lPlayerRace != 0”

    Also:
    – Resource_CrystalMine.clb needs to be renamed Resource_GemstoneMine.clb and the link in the .rpk modified accordingly.
    The issue in the log: “[15:10:59][ERROR][WORLD_ACTIVATE]Animation component activated for an entity Gemstone Mine with a model (Crystal Mine- Not Claimed) with no rig” can be solved by removing the “Animation” in Entities/Components (for the Gold Mine’s animation to work, the Gemstone Mine would need to use the same rig but that’s impossible, I tested in the .clb, some bones are different).
    – the errors in the log:
    [15:11:04][ERROR][WORLD_ACTIVATE][SCRIPTING ERROR] Error in line number 3. Message was:
    [15:11:07][ERROR][WORLD_ACTIVATE] [string “”]:3: attempt to index field ‘STRUCT_GLOW’ (a nil value)

    [15:11:07][ERROR][WORLD_ACTIVATE] Callstack:
    [15:11:07][ERROR][WORLD_ACTIVATE] – NATIVE EventCall “OnVisitStateChanged” in [((null))]
    are caused by the Flame of Grauth (SR version) from Decodence. It’ an issue related to the Decodence Map Editor Content mod, not the SR mod. I was not able to identify its source as I didn’t see any script associated to the entity in the .rpk. Maybe someone else can find it.

    #280274

    Hiliadan
    Member

    Several RMG issues:
    RMG – Missing the following sites on the Shadow layer: Raven Home, Sword of the Ashen Rose, Caslte of the Lich King, Maelstrom
    RMG – Several sites have very high densities and are concentrated in cluster, and even worse, they’re near starting cities: Forgotten Thrones, Archon Fort
    RMG – The RMG generates a lot of Void, and just links cities together with roads but that creates vast areas of empty space. It should not be possible to move for 3 turns without anything to clear.

    RMG – Starting cities can have crazy income in their vicinity (and a lot of site duplicates), as illustrated by this screenshot

    That comes on top of the RMG issues reported earlier: road, lack of Warband Campfire, crash (reported by Gloweye), Undead Archons on the Shadow layer, Shadow Gates in the middle of water on surface.

    #280275

    HousePet
    Member

    I’ve got a Raven Home in my current Shadow Layer.

    #280353

    Refineus
    Member

    – Archon saints are vulnerable to shadow sickness
    – Eldritch Horrors are vulnerable to shadow sickness *
    – Elder Eldritch’s are vulnerable to shadow sickness *

    *’ Are they supposed to be vulnerable. I have not read anything about them. I believe they should be immune?

    #280354

    Bob5
    Member

    – Archon saints are vulnerable to shadow sickness
    – Eldritch Horrors are vulnerable to shadow sickness *
    – Elder Eldritch’s are vulnerable to shadow sickness *

    *’ Are they supposed to be vulnerable. I have not read anything about them. I believe they should be immune?

    Archon Saints should be through them being Archons. The others don’t have anything that’d make them get Shadow Walking as far as I can tell.

    #280368

    HousePet
    Member

    Discovered a major bug: I never remember to build up my armies and get distracted by exploring… Also I had all the generation settings set to random and I think it had decided on minimal everything, so that wasn’t a good test of stuff. So I started a new map with the settings on Average. Doing so caused a crash:

    [19:42:11]Generating random level with seed: 3529862781.
    [19:44:22]RMG Zone Settings: Land (Zones)
    [19:44:22]RMG Terrain Settings: Land (Terrain)
    [19:44:22]RMG Structure Settings: Land (Structure)
    [19:44:22]RMG Zone Settings: Shadow Realm (Zones)
    [19:44:22]RMG Terrain Settings: Shadow Realm (Terrain)
    [19:44:22]RMG Structure Settings: Shadow Realm (Structure)
    [19:44:22][ERROR]Assertion failed: “pType!=NULL”
    [19:44:35]Message: Can’t assign a NULL type!
    [19:44:35]d:\source.aow.steam\creator\gc\source\hexworld\materialworld\GCMaterialHexCellData.cpp(155): (click to open)
    [19:44:35]
    [19:44:35][ERROR]Assertion failed: “false”
    [19:44:40]Message: Meandor’s name be praised! The game just crashed. A mini dump file was created at C:\Users\Simon\Documents\My Games\AoW3\Logs\minidump0719_1825.dmp. Give the .dmp, .pdb and .exe files to the programmers.
    [19:44:40]d:\source.aow.steam\aow\game\source\PC/MainPC.cpp(74): (click to open)

    Have had a few other errors, though I suspect the last two might not be mod related:

    [14:57:24][ERROR][HUD_TomeOfWonders]Unit Ability Throw Spear is invalid: Event has no targeters attached!
    [14:57:26][ERROR][HUD_TomeOfWonders]Unit Ability Throw Spear is invalid! Event is invalid!
    [14:57:26][ERROR][HUD_TomeOfWonders]Structure Shadow Gate invalid! No Icon!
    [14:57:26][ERROR][HUD_TomeOfWonders]Structure Hollow Grove invalid! No Icon!
    [14:57:26][ERROR][HUD_TomeOfWonders]Structure Haunted Inn invalid! No Icon!
    [14:57:26][ERROR][HUD_TomeOfWonders]Structure Glass Furnace invalid! No Icon!

    [16:09:08][QUEST] Trying to generate absorb quest with value of 153
    [16:09:08]Generated global quest: TDomainStructureQuestGenerator
    [16:09:08]No valid quest generator to generate quest.
    [16:09:08][QUEST] Could not generate the quest
    [16:09:08][ERROR]Assertion failed: “false”
    [16:09:08]Message: Cannot retrieve quest difficulty, no interaction option available for this city
    [16:09:08]d:\source.aow.steam\aow\aowc\source\ageofwonders\strategicmap\entities\cities\citysupport\IndependentCityPlayerInfo.cpp(430): (click to open)
    [16:09:08]
    [16:09:08][QUEST] Trying to generate absorb quest with value of 0

    [16:38:18][ERROR]Assertion failed: “marker != NULL”
    [16:38:18]Message: Trying to update unexisting marker!
    [16:38:18]d:\source.aow.steam\aow\aowc\source\ageofwonders\gamedata\quests\QuestFXHolder.cpp(123): (click to open)

    Here is a huge pile of notes I’ve collected since my last post:
    Shadow Void looks like tar. Not sure what we can do with it. Can we replace or alter the animation of the waves? Replacing with the swirls would be optimal. Second place would be to replace with a star field. Alternatively we could slow down the animation speed of the waves so they don’t look as liquid.
    “Gold” Mines giving too much income and there is a space missing in the description. “Adds +10 <gold>+10<mana>” Should be “Adds +10 <gold> +10<mana>”. (Although Tombs have a rather compressed description as well. But I don’t like them either.)
    Do non Shadow Elf races dislike Shadow Realm? Its not stated in the ToW. And doesn’t appear to be the case. Did we drop this, or is it just not implemented yet?
    Unsure about the naming of the “Vulnerable to Shadow Sickness” effect that appear to be applying the stat reduction. Can we change it to say “Shadow Sickness”, have it as a red name (does that require it to be a specific duration temp effect). Also the description should explicitly state that the debuff is currently being applied. I realise there may be game limitations here, but perhaps the “Vulnerable” effect could apply a second effect being more explicit.
    Particle Swirl on the Shadow Gate Teleporter is a bit over the top. Possibly the wrong blend method is being used. It appears to be Matte when it should be Lighten?
    Shadow Weed doesn’t need to be in patches of three.
    We are going to need a different name for the ‘Living’ Archon Titan. Possibly ‘Living Archon Titan’? Or should we just rename the undead one?
    Gold Mines exist in the Shadow Realm.
    Hollow Grove defenders seem quite tough for a Legendary: Horned God, Hunter Spider Queen, Vampire Spider Queen and Mature Shock Serpent.
    Draconians are immune to Shadow Sickness, but this is not documented in game.
    Shadow Weed could do with standing out more. Possibly a colour alteration to the flowers, or larger flowers?
    Shadow Elf Champion Economic does not reduce the cost of Necromancer’s Dark Tower.
    Shadow Demon Slayer doesn’t have the damage type icon in the description.
    Shadow Elf Deity Economic does not add the +10 casting points to the Palace of the Perished description.
    Wizard Tower Ruins in the shadow realm had a battlefield that just looked like a campsite? Okay, that appears to be normal.
    Infused have Armoured, but the flavour text says they are unarmoured.
    SE Builder is missing the Build Water Fortress ability.
    Walking over Shadow Weed with a Shadow Sick unit gives it an extra +1 phys/blight/fire/frost/spirit/shock damage on its Melee Strike until next turn.
    Glass Armoury seems rather cheap.
    Can we change the magma in the Glass Furnace from orange to blue? They look rather like Magma Forges.
    Had a SE city offer me an Orc Black Knight as a reward.
    Unoras Tasklor looks weird and creepy. Like evil clown Santa…
    Foundries in the Shadow Realm doesn’t make much sense.
    Forge of Dreams has incorrect income: +10 Gold/Mana.
    Celestial Pool list Undefined Trigger as the usage.
    Gemstone Mines and Glass Furnaces don’t count as Treasure Sites.
    Various new structures don’t seem to have yields at all (though some count as Treasure Sites for class bonuses.

    #280381

    Bob5
    Member

    Shadow Elf Champion Economic does not reduce the cost of Necromancer’s Dark Tower.

    Fixed this for the next build.

    Unsure about the naming of the “Vulnerable to Shadow Sickness” effect that appear to be applying the stat reduction. Can we change it to say “Shadow Sickness”, have it as a red name (does that require it to be a specific duration temp effect). Also the description should explicitly state that the debuff is currently being applied. I realise there may be game limitations here, but perhaps the “Vulnerable” effect could apply a second effect being more explicit.

    This is indeed game limitations, we can’t have an effect appear and disappear based on the layer the unit is in unfortunately, this is essentially the best compromise we can get. It’s a bit like Night Vision in a way, Night Vision always shows up in the unit panel but it only increases vision range in the underground layer.

    Do non Shadow Elf races dislike Shadow Realm? Its not stated in the ToW. And doesn’t appear to be the case. Did we drop this, or is it just not implemented yet?

    I’m not sure honestly. I reckon we still need to do a lot of balance testing in the beta, I guess we’ll see how it goes there.

    Shadow Demon Slayer doesn’t have the damage type icon in the description.

    This is intentional by me. Shadow Demon Slayer adds +3 damage to the first damage channel in use, which doesn’t have to be the physical channel. The same is done for Shadow Elf Slayer (can be added to weapons in the Item Forge and is part of the Killer Instinct spell) and Strong Will Slayer.

    Walking over Shadow Weed with a Shadow Sick unit gives it an extra +1 phys/blight/fire/frost/spirit/shock damage on its Melee Strike until next turn.

    If I understand correctly this is intentional. Shadow Weeds effectively should cancel out the Shadow Sickness effect on the Shadow Layer. They give +1 def, +1 resistance, +1 base damage to all damage channels. Base damage is essentially the damage done by the basic melee attack of the unit (usually melee strike), sometimes also used in specialised melee attacks like Assassin’s Strike or Defensive Strike.

    Shadow Elf Deity Economic does not add the +10 casting points to the Palace of the Perished description.

    Not really sure what’s going on here, I’ve checked everything in the Package Manager and everything seems to be linked up correctly. Is it still adding the casting points bonus to your total if you build the Palace of the Perished? It should only work for Palace of the Perished in Shadow Elf cities, and only if you’re playing Necromancer. Other classes should get the bonus to Grand Palace instead (only in Shadow Elf cities).

    Glass Armoury seems rather cheap.

    It is, but I think it’s still quite fair as the boost it actually gives is relatively small for a MCU and it still takes a turn to build.

    Do non Shadow Elf races dislike Shadow Realm? Its not stated in the ToW. And doesn’t appear to be the case. Did we drop this, or is it just not implemented yet?

    I honestly don’t know. It’s easy enough to implement, maybe it was deemed to be too punishing to add on top of the Shadow Sickness penalties?

    #280383

    Bob5
    Member

    Update on Shadow Elf Deity Economic. It indeed doesn’t show up in the description for the Grand Palace (for non-Necromancer classes) or Palace of the Perished (for Necromancer classes), but the Casting Point boost IS applied when building the unit. I’m not sure why it doesn’t change the description, maybe Casting Points are unique like that? The mana boost on the Champion Economic Race Governance does show up in the descriptions for the class buildings. Does anyone know if the Great Temples update their description in High Elf cities with High Elf Deity Economic?

    #280384

    Hiliadan
    Member

    Discovered a major bug: I never remember to build up my armies and get distracted by exploring… Also I had all the generation settings set to random and I think it had decided on minimal everything, so that wasn’t a good test of stuff. So I started a new map with the settings on Average. Doing so caused a crash:

    I am a bit confused here: is the bug that you can’t build your armies or that there was a crash during RMG?
    This crash looks very much like you forgot to reset the RMG settings after switching on the RMG mod. If it happens again after resetting RMG, please report again.

    [14:57:24][ERROR][HUD_TomeOfWonders]Unit Ability Throw Spear is invalid: Event has no targeters attached!
    [14:57:26][ERROR][HUD_TomeOfWonders]Unit Ability Throw Spear is invalid! Event is invalid!
    [14:57:26][ERROR][HUD_TomeOfWonders]Structure Shadow Gate invalid! No Icon!
    [14:57:26][ERROR][HUD_TomeOfWonders]Structure Hollow Grove invalid! No Icon!
    [14:57:26][ERROR][HUD_TomeOfWonders]Structure Haunted Inn invalid! No Icon!
    [14:57:26][ERROR][HUD_TomeOfWonders]Structure Glass Furnace invalid! No Icon!

    This and all the stuff below (Quest, etc.) looks very much like what happened to me earlier when the .taf didn’t decompress properly. Please delete the SR folders in your UserContent, put back the 2 .taf, let them decompress, quit the launcher, relaunch to make sure it’s really decompressed, then try again.

    Shadow Void looks like tar.

    It will be very complicated to change all the visual stuff. Charlatan is not working on the project any more. vfxrob has limited time. And Lordoflinks is also busy + can only do models, not animations.
    We could remove the animation entirely but not sure it’s necessary? Personally, I like the Void how it is now.

    “Gold” Mines giving too much income and there is a space missing in the description. “Adds +10 <gold>+10<mana>” Should be “Adds +10 <gold> +10<mana>”. (Although Tombs have a rather compressed description as well. But I don’t like them either.)

    That’s the Gemstone Mines, the name is currently bugged. We can rework the description later for the blank but first we need to work on balancing the income of all the sites.

    Do non Shadow Elf races dislike Shadow Realm? Its not stated in the ToW. And doesn’t appear to be the case. Did we drop this, or is it just not implemented yet?

    It was decided like that a while ago. And so far it feels very balanced to me. Shadow Sickness is already a big drag, especially for Tigrans and Orcs with already low resistance. And SE have other bonus in the Shadow Realm like several units with concealment.

    Unsure about the naming of the “Vulnerable to Shadow Sickness” effect that appear to be applying the stat reduction. Can we change it to say “Shadow Sickness”, have it as a red name (does that require it to be a specific duration temp effect). Also the description should explicitly state that the debuff is currently being applied. I realise there may be game limitations here, but perhaps the “Vulnerable” effect could apply a second effect being more explicit.

    As Bob said + please check this explanation: https://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Hiliadan/Shadow_Realm_Community_Expansion#Shadow_Sickness_and_Shadow_Walker

    Particle Swirl on the Shadow Gate Teleporter is a bit over the top. Possibly the wrong blend method is being used. It appears to be Matte when it should be Lighten?

    Not sure what you mean. But in any case, it was planned that the animation would be reworked and that the current animation would be used only during the activation of the Gates.

    Shadow Weed doesn’t need to be in patches of three.

    I thought that too but on second thought, how will you do when you move with 3 stacks of units? So I think it’s good to have 3 of them.

    We are going to need a different name for the ‘Living’ Archon Titan. Possibly ‘Living Archon Titan’? Or should we just rename the undead one?

    Yes, need to rename the Undead one to Undead Archon Titan. Noting that.

    Gold Mines exist in the Shadow Realm.

    See above, I believe they’re Gemstone Mines?

    Hollow Grove defenders seem quite tough for a Legendary: Horned God, Hunter Spider Queen, Vampire Spider Queen and Mature Shock Serpent.

    Legendary is one notch below Mystical, it’s normal they’re very hard to clear. The Hollow Grove is based on another existing Legendary site (forgot which one) in terms of the strength of defenders. So yeah it’s tough but that’s normal.

    Draconians are immune to Shadow Sickness, but this is not documented in game.

    They have Shadow Walker displayed in their unit panel.

    Shadow Weed could do with standing out more. Possibly a colour alteration to the flowers, or larger flowers?

    See above, hard to redo the visuals. Lordoflinks might be able to redo the texture. I suggest you keep that in mind and suggest it again when all the icons, and the .clb optimization, etc. are done, and we see then if we have the resources to do it.

    Shadow Elf Champion Economic does not reduce the cost of Necromancer’s Dark Tower.
    Shadow Demon Slayer doesn’t have the damage type icon in the description.
    Shadow Elf Deity Economic does not add the +10 casting points to the Palace of the Perished description.

    So Bob fixed the 1st one. I’m not convinced that the icon shouldn’t be there for the 2nd one since it is there for other similar abilities as far as I know? E.g. Orc Slayer.
    Could you please confirm the 3rd one after re-installing the expansion (see beginning of post)? It might be linked to the incorrect depackaging.

    Glass Armoury seems rather cheap.
    Can we change the magma in the Glass Furnace from orange to blue? They look rather like Magma Forges.

    As Bob said for the first one, it only gives +1 melee, compare to other similar MCU, the price was designed in comparison to other MCU.
    For Glass Furnace, do-able but see above for visual changes.

    Had a SE city offer me an Orc Black Knight as a reward.

    Which city size? What Quest name?

    Foundries in the Shadow Realm doesn’t make much sense.

    Are you talking about the Glass Furnace?

    Forge of Dreams has incorrect income: +10 Gold/Mana.
    Celestial Pool list Undefined Trigger as the usage.

    That’s the income planned: https://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Forge_of_Dreams
    Could you please give more details for the 2nd one?

    Gemstone Mines and Glass Furnaces don’t count as Treasure Sites.

    Please clarify: for which purpose? Which spells?

    Various new structures don’t seem to have yields at all (though some count as Treasure Sites for class bonuses.

    Which ones?

    #280387

    HousePet
    Member

    Me never remembering to build armies is a bug with me, not the mod…

    I got the new game crash without changing the mods at all. Do we need to press restore to default every time we start a new map?

    Grabbing Shadow Weed to counter Shadow Sickness appears to be adding every damage channel to a unit’s melee attack for the rest of that turn. Unsure it real or just a display error in the unit details.

    For the additions to city improvement yields from RG upgrades, you need to add them to the structure’s descriptions. They aren’t automatically added. So if nobody has made the modifications to the Palaces to display the extra casting points, it will give casting points but never display on the tooltip.

    Good point about the Shadow Weed clusters for when you have multiple stacks. I haven’t tried a non Shadow Walking race in the Shadow Realm yet.

    I meant the Race: Draconian page/description in the ToW. It doesn’t list Shadow Walker.

    Actual Gold Mines, not incorrectly labelled Gemstone Mines are still being generated in the Shadow Realm. Also, its the Foundry from Decodence (I presume) being spawned in the Shadow Realm that seems out of place. Its possible someone could have stolen Dreadnaught tech and built an illegal Foundry in the Shadow Realm, but it seems unlikely and off theme.

    Didn’t record the size or quest that rewarded me a Black Knight. Didn’t know it made a difference sorry.

    The Forge of Dreams was originally proposed as Production/Knowledge but seemed to have been added to the wiki as a copy of the Gemstone Mine.

    The button you have to press to trigger the Celestial Pool’s healing ability reads “Undefined: Trigger”.

    Gemstone Mines and Glass Furnaces are not getting a benefit from Sanctified Sites. Hrm and neither are Mana Nodes in the Shadow Realm or the Celestial Pool. Seems to work for Surface and Shadow Realm Water/Creation Nodes though, so maybe there is a bug in the base game stopping plain Mana Nodes from counting as Treasure Sites for those spells.

    Archon Forts and Hollow Groves are giving no yields. Ah, these are listed as To Be Confirmed on the wiki page.

    Sorry for not being clearer with some of those.

    I have a couple more:
    Willbreaker Hoard does not stop spawning when you have killed all the non Willbreaker units. Other similar spells do and if you don’t have some very mobile units in your army, you can’t win the battle.

    Forgotten Thrones don’t seem to give rewards for clearing them.

    I have yet to see an Archon Dwelling, Warband Camp or Larva Pool (Though I have seen a city get captured by a Shadow Demon Lord, so those might be appearing rarely). I’ve also not seen any water in the Shadow Realm yet, so no Maelstroms. Nor have I seen any Crystal Trees, Flowrock Quarries or Vaults of Knowledge. I have however had Great Farms and Wells of Souls. I haven’t fully explored my surface layer yet (Islands generation) but I haven’t seen a single Oyster Reef yet.

    I’ve got some Arctic terrain in the Shadow Realm, but as its a 3 hex wide spread around a Forgotten Throne, I suspect Arctica put it there. Oddly, I’ve got a single tile of Temperate with a Gold Mine on it as well.

    While I haven’t exhausted my research options, Shadow Weed Decoction has not appeared yet.

    I think I might be able to do a few minor graphical tweaks, but that is obviously not a priority at the moment.

    #280388

    Bob5
    Member

    Grabbing Shadow Weed to counter Shadow Sickness appears to be adding every damage channel to a unit’s melee attack for the rest of that turn. Unsure it real or just a display error in the unit details.

    It’s real. If I remember correctly Shadow Sickness should also give -1 to all damage channels on a unit’s melee attack, so the Shadow Weeds’ Lesser Shadow Walking simply nullifies that.

    I meant the Race: Draconian page/description in the ToW. It doesn’t list Shadow Walker.

    True. We never updated that description. I’ll take a look at that later.

    #280389

    HousePet
    Member

    Hrm, adding every damage channel to a unit, even for one turn could be a bit exploitable.

    #280394

    HousePet
    Member

    Okay, Flowrock Quarries (supposed to) are generated in the Shadow Realm, as are Magma Forges (not supposed to).

    #280397

    Hiliadan
    Member

    I got the new game crash without changing the mods at all. Do we need to press restore to default every time we start a new map?

    No, not at each game but maybe you forgot to do it at the beginning?

    Willbreaker Hoard does not stop spawning when you have killed all the non Willbreaker units. Other similar spells do and if you don’t have some very mobile units in your army, you can’t win the battle.

    Yes, that’s on purpose, it’s the most difficult site of the game, so it’s a bit different than usual sites. 😛 And you’re not supposed to clear it if you don’t have an army fit for it. 🙂

    Gemstone Mines and Glass Furnaces are not getting a benefit from Sanctified Sites. Hrm and neither are Mana Nodes in the Shadow Realm or the Celestial Pool.

    Ok, I see I didn’t list which sites were treasure sites for the purpose of strategic spells giving bonus linked to treasure sites. Let’s maybe try to list all of them now. Which sites are not treasure sites (for spell purpose) in the base game?

    I have yet to see an Archon Dwelling, Warband Camp or Larva Pool (Though I have seen a city get captured by a Shadow Demon Lord, so those might be appearing rarely). I’ve also not seen any water in the Shadow Realm yet, so no Maelstroms. Nor have I seen any Crystal Trees, Flowrock Quarries or Vaults of Knowledge. I have however had Great Farms and Wells of Souls. I haven’t fully explored my surface layer yet (Islands generation) but I haven’t seen a single Oyster Reef yet.

    I did see Larva Pools. Warband Campfire not spawning is a known issue. I add the issue for the Archon Dwellings.
    Maelstrom: yeah true but we did not plan any water on the SR layer. So do we drop it or how do we do?
    I did see Crystal Trees and Vaults.
    For Oyster Reef, please try to generate a few Large maps and use “tasman” or “barentz” cheats to see if you really can’t see any.

    I’ve got some Arctic terrain in the Shadow Realm, but as its a 3 hex wide spread around a Forgotten Throne, I suspect Arctica put it there. Oddly, I’ve got a single tile of Temperate with a Gold Mine on it as well.

    Yes, Forgotten Thrones project a climate around them.
    Would you have a screenshot of the Gold Mine? I think that will help Gloweye identify to which pass it belongs and fix it.

    While I haven’t exhausted my research options, Shadow Weed Decoction has not appeared yet.

    Yeah, I noticed that too. Added to the bug list.

    Hrm, adding every damage channel to a unit, even for one turn could be a bit exploitable.

    You misunderstood Bob. It’s a display issue, the units actually get +1-1=0 so no new damage. It seems we can’t fix the display issue on the strategic map. It disappears after any fight or reload or the save.

    EDIT:

    Forgotten Thrones don’t seem to give rewards for clearing them.

    Could you please confirm it applies to ALL Thrones? Which ones did you try? (Artica’s, Mab’s, etc.)

    • This reply was modified 3 years, 11 months ago by  Hiliadan.
    #280401

    HousePet
    Member

    I’m not sure what definition or balance reasons for the Treasure Site bonuses were, but it looks like anything that is permanent but not a Visit Site is a Treasure Site. So Shrines, Plants, Hearts and recruitment/spawning sites don’t seem to count. Except that DLC3 adds Shrine to the Relentless Lich and Well of Souls to this list. The Shrine is in the Visit Site category in the package while the Well of Souls is in the Treasure Site category. It appears that Mana Node – SR is missing from the additional Treasure Sites list.
    Based on those rules, Shadow Weed and Heart of Shadows should not count as Treasure Sites. Glass Furnace and Celestial Pool are unclear as to whether they should count or not.
    Possibly not for this thread, but I think we should add a couple of Shrines for Shrines of Unlife to work off, and to bump up the Visit sites.

    I think we should just drop Maelstrom if we aren’t having any water. Its of no use without water anyway.

    I had cleared an Artica and an Arachna Forgotten Throne and got no rewards. And failed a Mab one. Hang on, these are linked to 1 of 3 different adventure sets which then link to one reward set anyway… I’ve never tried to mess with these before, but I think the problem might be that it is set to give 0 skills and 0 items.

    With Forgotten Thrones giving bonuses that don’t display on the strategic map, we should add them to their description.

    #291285

    gladis
    Member

    Im not sure what definition or balance reasons for the Treasure Site bonuses were, but it looks like anything that is permanent but not a Visit Site is a Treasure Site. So Shrines, Plants, Hearts and recruitment/spawning sites don’t seem to count. Except that DLC3 adds Shrine to the Relentless Lich and Well of Souls to this list. The Shrine is in the Visit Site category in the package while the Well of Souls is in the Treasure Site category. It appears that Mana Node – SR is missing from the additional Treasure Sites list.
    Based on those rules, Shadow Weed and Heart of Shadows should not count as Treasure Sites. Glass Furnace and Celestial Pool are unclear as to whether they should count or not.
    Possibly not for this thread, but I think we should add a couple of Shrines for Shrines of Unlife to work off, and to bump up the Visit sites.

    FYI:
    Resource Structures: Nodes, Crystal Tree, Flowrock Quarry, Gold Mine, Great Farm, Magma Forge, Oyster Reef, Raging Maelstrom, Spring of Life,. Trading Post, Vault of Knowledge (you see, here are listed „Treasure Sites you don´t have to enter before combat“,too)
    Visit Structures: Bountiful Melons, Flowers of Solace, Haste Berries, Inn, Lucky Cloverfields, Watchtower, Well of Souls, Shrines
    Treasure Structures: Hearts, and all the „Treasure Sites you have to enter before combat“ (Ancient Ruins, Castle of the Lich King, Dungeon, Forbidden Sanctum, Hall of the Forefathers, Lost City, Lost Library, Sphinx Temple, Sunken City, Tomb, Wizard Tower Ruins, Ziggurat)

    #291364

    Hiliadan
    Member

    Small one:
    – Shadow Elf Apprentice’s Dispel Magic and Shadow Fire icon display in tactical combat should be switched: Dispel Magic in #7 and Shadow Fire in #2 (it’s currently the opposite)

    it looks like anything that is permanent but not a Visit Site is a Treasure Site. So Shrines, Plants, Hearts and recruitment/spawning sites don’t seem to count.

    We need to distinguish between:
    – what sites are for the RMG (settings that can affect them):
    * Visit sites are, I believe, all the sites that Gladis listed and which are “visited” i.e. that gives an effect when you go over them.
    * Treasure sites are sites that are not Visit or Resource sites.
    – what sites are for spells like Sanctified Sites. Here Treasure sites has another meaning and I guess there can be discrepancies.

    Except that DLC3 adds Shrine to the Relentless Lich and Well of Souls to this list. The Shrine is in the Visit Site category in the package while the Well of Souls is in the Treasure Site category. It appears that Mana Node – SR is missing from the additional Treasure Sites list.

    Not sure what this Shrine is? To which categories are you referring to (see above)?
    Same question for the Mana Nodes.

    Glass Furnace and Celestial Pool are unclear as to whether they should count or not.

    They clearly should be Visit sites (effects when you walk over them), just like they are classified in the Wikia: https://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Hiliadan/Shadow_Realm_Community_Expansion#Visit_structures

    #291366

    HousePet
    Member

    I was mostly referring to the list that spells like Sanctified Sites use to determine which sites get a bonus. I presume this is separate to the actual site definition which I expect is what the RMG uses to scale the amount it creates.

    Shrine of the Relentless Lich is the grim reaper looking one. And I’m referring to the list that those spells check. Our addition to that list is missing Mana Node – SR.

    I said that Glass Furnace and Celestial Pool are unclear for two reasons.
    1) DLC3 broke the mold a bit by adding Shrine to the Relentless Lich (probably an error) and Well of Souls (I think this one is actually defined as a treasure site for generation) to the “Treasure Sites” list.
    2) We should consider the balance consequences. Eg the Glass Furnace pretty much replaces the Magma Forge, which means we are replacing a Treasure Site with a Visit Site.

    #291593

    Dr_K
    Member

    – Arachna Forgotten Throne lack their reward sets https://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Forgotten_Throne

    Nothing is actually being given for ANY forgotten throne. However, nothing seems to be a problem from what I can tell.

    Might have to do with the fact that it is a “Terrain Painting” structure type like Hearts instead of a Treasure Site.

    – Larva Pool: the Excess use mod is apparently set on gold instead of mana http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Larva_Pool

    Fixed. Excess use was set properly, but multiplier weren’t.

    – SE Builder is missing the Build Water Fortress ability.

    Fixed.

    – (living) Archon Dwellings do not have their minor race name displayed, e.g. in the diplomacy screen, it’s displayed “(null) (Neutral)” instead of “Archon (Neutral)”

    Fixed broken name link.

    – Shadow Artifact gives Shadow Sickness to Undeads (“Shadow Sickness” appears in their unit panel) even if in the end, they do not get affected by its effect (no -1/-1/-1)

    Undead have been added to the forbidden list for the ability.

    • This reply was modified 3 years, 10 months ago by  Dr_K.
    • This reply was modified 3 years, 10 months ago by  Dr_K.
    • This reply was modified 3 years, 10 months ago by  Dr_K.
    #291600

    Hiliadan
    Member

    Hiliadan wrote:

    – Arachna Forgotten Throne lack their reward sets https://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Forgotten_Throne

    Nothing is actually being given for ANY forgotten throne. However, nothing seems to be a problem from what I can tell.

    Might have to do with the fact that it is a “Terrain Painting” structure type like Hearts instead of a Treasure Site.

    Ok I rewrote the issue:
    – Forgotten Throne do not give any reward despite reward sets apparently being in the mod tool https://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Hiliadan/Forgotten_Throne Is it because they are “Terrain Painting” structure type like Hearts instead of a Treasure Site?

    That’s actually pretty bad. Would it be possible to check? For instance by making a dummy Terrain Painting structure and see if changing its type to a “normal” treasure site makes it reward work?

    @housepet: going to work on sites soon and answer you then.

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