The balance between active and passive healing is wrong:

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Home Forums Age of Wonders 3 Discussions Balance Suggestions The balance between active and passive healing is wrong:

This topic contains 3 replies, has 3 voices, and was last updated by  Hiliadan 4 years, 3 months ago.

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  • #243734

    Jolly Joker
    Member

    Active Healing (with abilities) works in every combat AND as regenerattion, and the difference of beeing left with only regeneration (say, Tigran Rogue) and being able to field active Healing (say, Necro), is just too big.
    I don’t have the time right now for a big analysis, that’s why I’ll just come up with the conclusion right now:

    I would like to try a general increase in standard Regeneration to, well, say 10.
    I would also like to try a reduction of hero-based regeneration abilities (like Field Medic), for example to 5. Also, Draconians, and Heroes Fast Healing could be a +5 only.
    We might reduce Victory Rush in that case to 6, and Fishing and Wetland Foraging to 5.

    Healing abilities, except Heal Undead, Repair Machine and Mend Magical could probably reduced by 5 as well, with Theo maybe upping Healing again to 20.

    All that with the aim to make the Healing stuff that can be used for free and multiple times within a turn less impactful as it currently is.

    Just think Halflings and Necromancer for thinking this through. With Halflings IN GENERAL, Luck may even out physical weakness, but specifically it means, that units that are not lucky look pretty ragged after two hits. Regeneration won’t get that back in line – add a Healing ability, though, and you can put the Healing where you need it – and the effect of this can be seen with Necro who gets along well with ONLY Healing and NO regeneration.

    See it this way: things have started with 6 regeneration from the start. Then HPs of low-tier units were increased so that they wouldn’t DIE immediately, while the worst cases got specific abilities. Meanwhile, though, that means that the difference between the minimum of healing and regeneration and a comfortable situation in that regard is too big, and consequently that all Healing abities are too good compared with that.

    This would be different, if Healing abilities were limited to once per TURN (like it was in the games before 3), but going back to that would create more problems, so I think we should simply increase standard regeneration and decrease all special stuff.

    • This topic was modified 4 years, 5 months ago by  Jolly Joker.
    #243774

    I would say no. There are too many ripple effects with changing heals and regeneration like that; it would likely cause more problems.

    #243786

    Jolly Joker
    Member

    Like what?
    You should be able to name something, otherwise it’s just a wild claim without any foundation.

    I think, the generally unbalanced situation is pretty obvious. Consider a regular stack led by a hero. Hero will regenerate 12 points, the others 6 – so that’s 42 points of health the stack as a whole can at most regenerate, provided, everyone has at least wounds for 6 HP.
    If the hero has healing, and if you did 1 fight, you add another 40 points, 20 in the fight (and where it counts), and another 20 between turns.
    Now consider Necro. If you start with 2 heroes, which you do, THEY will regenerate (as long as HoD isn’t researched, and between them they can Heal 50 undead HP in (each) battle and another 50 between turns – PLUS the 24 the two heroes regenerate.

    Without ANY healing at all, even if you have 2 heroes in, your regeneration for the whole turn is 48.

    If you consider Draconians meanwhile, with DOUBLE the regeneration, they are not in the comfort zone with 12 regs alone. When you play Drac Warlord, getting Field Medic is a really good thing; with a regeneration rate of 18 points you ARE in the comfort zone.

    The problem is, that the basic regeneration is too low. If you get a simple Infantry down to under 10 HPs it becomes worthless, because it will die after the first hit. There is nothing wrong with pausing a turn or something, but regenerating 6 HPs ONLY per turn won’t change that quickly. The problem with regeneration as such is, that when you have JUST ONE (or two) badly damaged units, and the rest is at full strength, it will do nothing for your badly damaged unit(s), while those at full health don’t profit.
    Active Healing allows to put the HPs where they are needed, which makes it invaluable.

    One general way to change regeneration would be a conversion of movement to Healing: resting an infantry for a turn would give you back 28 HPs – you might include regeneration here, so that the first 6 HPs not spend would do nothing, since you’ll regenerate 6 HPs anyway.

    I don’t think this is moddable, though.

    As it is, the difference is just too big, and I would like to try the effect of a changed balance here.

    #245562

    Hiliadan
    Member

    I would like to try a general increase in standard Regeneration to, well, say 10.
    I would also like to try a reduction of hero-based regeneration abilities (like Field Medic), for example to 5. Also, Draconians, and Heroes Fast Healing could be a +5 only.
    We might reduce Victory Rush in that case to 6, and Fishing and Wetland Foraging to 5.

    Healing abilities, except Heal Undead, Repair Machine and Mend Magical could probably reduced by 5 as well, with Theo maybe upping Healing again to 20.

    All that with the aim to make the Healing stuff that can be used for free and multiple times within a turn less impactful as it currently is.

    […]

    This would be different, if Healing abilities were limited to once per TURN (like it was in the games before 3), but going back to that would create more problems, so I think we should simply increase standard regeneration and decrease all special stuff.

    The balance discussion currently favours making Healing a once per battle ability for heroes and leaders. That’s different from once per turn but still.

    I believe Theo and AD will require a small buff to compensate for the loss of healing. However, the boost needs not to be big. Boosting healing auras is a solution but as they appear early game, that would boost Theo and AD too much. Maybe associating the healing of AD and Theo to a small healing aura for the stack?

    I don’t quite understand why you wanted to boost base regeneration and decrease aura and other regenerations JJ? I would have boosted auras and regenerations such as foraging, and left the base regeneration intact.

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