Thoughts on 1.5 Warlord

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Home Forums Update v1.5 – Open Beta Balance Thoughts on 1.5 Warlord

This topic contains 4 replies, has 5 voices, and was last updated by  BLOODYBATTLEBRAIN 6 years, 9 months ago.

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  • #180641

    sayl
    Member

    I have been playing the beta for dozens of hours and I would like to firstly say the changes are by and large excellent, because this game spans so many rulesets I must disclaim for thoroughness that my experience comes from synchronous multiplayer mostly with friends but online as well and focuses on small map settings no underground and so these will reflect that game type.

    Warlords I think are much more competitive than they were, the resources acquired via scouting was lowered and the scout unit itself is an excellent addition. That being said outside of abuse of certain skills like berzerk spam the warlord still needs some love especially when it comes to spells. Most things for a warlord are buffs things like last stand and lions courage are completely excellent in theory in practice they are more often than not used against me more than helpful. The amount of dispels and enchantment stealing is extremely common, and playing a warlord often involves baiting your enemy for several turns with trash buffs before you can do any long lasting enchantments on your soldiers. Things like steadfast wards 2 turn duration is an excellent compromise where you can get immediate benefit and not be totally screwed by a stolen enchantment, one proposal would make all warlord buffs powerful but short lasting so that like direct spells they could be used for immediate benefit. There is also a large amount of redundancy I feel between warlord buffs and chosen skill buffs as most lines contain buffs that are very similar to the warlord specific ones when role is concerned.

    Humans: Human warlord I feel is solid the extra production along with the warlord buffs to lowering upkeep via loyalty and lowering gold cost. I know there are other posts about the longswordsman but I think this is particularly pronounced in a warlord game because the longswordsman can benefit the most from the warlord line of support skills, melee command, defense command, honor, charge command, blood brothers. Really anything would do, +1 resistance would do in my opinion it is in my opinion an important unit type for warlord progression scale for early offense and it is only slightly mitigated in humans because that tier is so quickly overshadowed by their production rate.

    Orc: Orc buffs warm my heart, many a multiplayer match have i lost because I refuse NOT to play orcs. Smart orcs play theos but smart orc is not my style, the lowered barracks is a god send and early Orc Greatsword with warlord leaders support is a fast and resilient early game that helps mute the rage induction that is late game orcs where magic and control effects are rampant but with the power of shock troopers who could stand against orcs without substantial chicanery.

    Dwarf: I have to say that to me Dwarf is the master tier of Warlord, much harder to control the happiness as easy access to mana and terraformer will have no effect (cant make mountains) their innate resilience goes well with Warlord, and the siege shop reduction in price while minor allows the Dwarfs a very strange early game of builders hall to siege shop where you are useless for 7 turns only to start breaking out in a big way with tier 1 racials that have the least likelihood of casualties on auto battle and that is a large buff in MP games where autobattle is required. Dwarf Monster Hunters with a mercenary buff with that large crossbow should have +3 to themselves because they too are monsters with every elemental resistance as well. Stylite Dwarf Phalanx and shielded manticores with defensive strike automatically que MLG memes in the back round on production, but that extremely slow start can be brutal if early scout aggression from enemy players make you churn out too many scouts and not enough focus on fighting units for progression so I think dwarf warlord is an aspirational choice when this beta is mastered and no sooner and my game is not there yet.

    Draconians: Draconians are still mostly about fast healing, crushers with improved wallclimb with the warlord buffs can devastate in an early siege and missile resistance makes them surprisingly resilient as auto battle “creepers” and the most important creep targets of scoundrels. Draconian Berzerkers are the upgraded version of this, strong creeping with strong siege abilities make Draconian a great choice, particularly in early game.

    Elfs: Ugh; Lame as hell ranged spam that in my opinion should be labeled a “toxic” mechanic as it is not fun to fight against nor is it particularly hard to spam longbows, then horse archers with some supporting units. The nerf to population growth is nice, but end game pop is not a problem. Elf warlord is strong I guess, but elf anything is strong as far as MP is concerned.

    Goblin: Goblins are a little underrated the floodlands +9 heal combined with the terraformer position as well as mastery of water “flood plains” makes for a happy bunch of goblins and a good defense against others as their blighted start bias and a huge authority of the sword buffed city with a million wetland tiles makes it hard to get to that goblin city and what you will find inside are warlord buffed swarm darters with +2 defense and stylited goblin butchers with powerful warlord buffs to help them survive. This is a double edged sword as it seems to me that a blighted bias start is mostly where the nastiest neutral creeps are (bone dragons, undead titan) and I have lost some games to uber neutral stacks just simply because blighted start bias, not that i wouldn’t want to start in blighted with goblins.

    Halfling: I played this as a joke, and only once but it went fairly well. Nightwatchmen are surprisingly good screens but they have nothing good to screen for in tier 1 as while halfling archers are good units they seem absolutely garbage in auto battles and this is a huge problem for MP. Terraform forest spam with authority makes for large dominion covered in annoying for others trees as well as substantial happiness. Halfling calvary seems really strong with pony riders with resistance, +1 ranged horse archers and the AOE on the eagle rider is a great addition. Thoroughbred mounts and halflings make for a nasty and mobile empire that seems excellent on defense and the manticores can take care of the siege at end game.

    TLDR: I feel that Warlords are in a better place certainly with the racial buffs and especially scouts, but something needs to be done about enchantment redundancy for skills and the ease of negation of unit buffing in general. Warlord outside of elf is still a dubious proposition in the type of game types that I play and that are fairly common settings for the MP community.

    #181992

    I kind of agree that buff redundancy is a problem in some cases. Triumph has a good take on it with Halflings where if they have Lucky twice, they get Very Lucky. I feel like most buffs that are shared via race/skill or something could get a small advantage.

    #198791

    NuMetal
    Member

    Elfs: Ugh; Lame as hell ranged spam that in my opinion should be labeled a “toxic” mechanic as it is not fun to fight against nor is it particularly hard to spam longbows, then horse archers with some supporting units. The nerf to population growth is nice, but end game pop is not a problem. Elf warlord is strong I guess, but elf anything is strong as far as MP is concerned.

    This is such a perfect explanation of High Elves!
    Exactly how I feel about them 😉

    What about Tigrans though?
    Don’t you have Eternal Lords? I’d like to hear what you think about them. Pounceon Berserkers seems incredible to me…

    #202843

    What enchantments are redundant? There’s Lion’s Courage for offense and Last Stand for defense and…what else? The other enchantments all provide specific niche bonuses (like Steadfast Ward) not covered by other spells. I’d say the biggest redundancy is Berserk vs Shout of Intimidation. As infuriatingly binary as Berserk is, I’d be interested in seeing that redesigned.

    One thing I would say, though, is that I wish Warlords had more expensive spells that were more powerful. The Warlord’s buffs are all very cost efficient, which is nice if I don’t bother getting casting points…but if I happen to get a bunch of CP upgrades and build my warlord leader as a fighter, I’m more than likely going to end up not being able to use most of my CP since it takes so many combat turns to burn through them while still fighting in melee.

    #228439

    Bumping this to ask what the OP thinks now with the new open beta.

    Specifically, Orcs got buffed.

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