Unit damage/HP/defense questions

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Home Forums Age of Wonders 3 Discussions Unit damage/HP/defense questions

This topic contains 6 replies, has 3 voices, and was last updated by  Gloweye 4 years, 8 months ago.

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  • #257327

    notme
    Member

    I see some T4 units have 25 – 30 HP damage on melee and similarly on ranged.
    This means 75 – 90 HP raw damage output (when unit can hit three times).

    Can any unit kill manticore in one hit if unit has proper buffs and manticore has proper debuffs?
    They have most HP of all units at around 140.

    This means even fire master dreadnought couldn’t kill them on fist round (not counting fire proof units) with hell fire + destabilized mana core (50/60 HP of fire damage respectively).
    I guess if there was cold war standoff between 7 leaders of 7 specializations, then fireproof units would dominate battlefields.
    Other ultimates are weaker.

    What units have highest natural (unbuffed) physical/magical defense?
    I know, that one unit of defense reduces damage by one HP.
    That means very weak attacks are just scratch and very strong attacks are barely weakened and attack strength equal to defense without protection, buff and debuff modifiers will take 10 HP as in this wiki: http://age-of-wonders-3.wikia.com/wiki/Calculations

    Is there unit stack composition, that can defeat any other stack of units no matter what units are in attacked stack?

    • This topic was modified 4 years, 8 months ago by  notme.
    #257329

    Windscion
    Member

    One hit? No.
    One round? Yup.
    Get morale down (Dread Omen, curse, inflict despair) and attack with Exploit Despair for much bonus damage, three times per round. (Late game necros can be very very nasty with this.)
    Use a spell that decreases resistances and hit with the appropriate element three times doing up to 160% damage each time, maybe more.

    #257330

    Gloweye
    Member

    Manticores have 85 Base HP, 125 on Elite. There’s a couple units with more. (However, the 140 shows up with the Throroughbred Mounts empire upgrade. Which most warlords will have, but it’s not guaranteed.)

    Suppose you have Degenerate on it (60% weakness vs everything), and perhaps Frostbitten and Enfeebling Fever (-2 and -3 Defense), their elite defense is reduced to 10. Say we have Some Resistance debuffs to also take the Resistance to 10.

    Say you have a Rogue Hero. It has Assassin’s Strike. Base damage for a Rogue Hero is 16, one more than most (warlords have +2 melee). That means that it’ll have sheet damage of 26/5 Physical/Blight. This will deal on average 51 *1.6 (elemental weakness) = 81 damage. Not quite there yet, but if we have good morale and do a Crit, the manticore takes 81 * 1.2 (max roll) * 1.35 (crit damage) = 131 damage. This kills the Manticore. Without backstabbing. A crit here will deal 212 damage, which means that it can have the Mounts empire upgrade and 5 Champion levels and still die in 1 hit.

    Since Degenerate is a Adept level spell, we can also use a Master Skill – Cardinal Culling. Another 40% physical weakness. Lets go for blight as well, say we have a Goblin Blight Doctor to apply Weakening. This reduces Def and Res both by 1 as well. Our damage becomes 53 * 2 = 106 damage – on average. High rolls here will 1-hit kill the Manticore. Otherwise, gotta get some more damage channels and resistance debuffs. Some items give 3 elemental damage channels, giving you 5 channels. If we can Stun the manticore beforehand, we’ll flank it for 2 bonus damage – which is huge if you can reduce it’s resistance to like 8 and have 5 damage channels.

    Under massively debuffed and flanking, Nightshade fairies can easily reach 100 damage in a single turn.

    Or just use Dread Reapers. That might work to. Be in a team with a Theocrat to have him use Armageddon to enhance your chances somewhat.

    Also, dont’ put that much importance in Mana Core. Sure, it’s strong – but expensive. If the game’s that late, any opponent that’s still a real threat will attack you from multiple angles – you can nuke one battlefield, but you’ll be attacked 4 times in one turn. And you’re out of CP, so your fireproof units get slaughtered without spell support. Or it’s a Rogue backdooring all your cities to wreck your income. A sorc can summon a stack of Node Serpents right in your backline, and made his leader stack invisible, so he’ll have a stack of horrors there to. And it’s more mobile than your dread could ever be. That Necro on the other side of the map is getting all units that died back, for a third of the battles that happen. So he’s not running out of troops anytime soon. The theocrat got’s massive armies with shrines and Devout units, while his Armageddon tears down your spirit immunity. And that Warlord produces a stack of manticores per turn, flying past your lines. And massive amounts of Warbreeds as backup against your machines, or firestorms. After all, they have Regrowth…..which means they heal faster than you can Mana Core them. (can only cast core once in every 3 turns, due to the delay. And it doesn’t even take half their health.)

    Highest unbuffed, I believe, is the Horned God. It has 16/13 Defense/Resistance as baseline.

    The strongest single stack is probably heroes. But your army is stronger if you spread them out. And multiple stacks against yours can always defeat it, unless they’re AI brainless.

    #257336

    notme
    Member

    Archdruid has all units hovering as ultimate spell you forgot to mention :p.
    So I guess if 7 AIs of 7 different classes and master specializations ganged on player, then it wouldn’t stand chance even if it had class and dwelling T4s protecting its cities.

    Can rouge master peacekeeper with partisian specializations win against team of 7 AIs of 7 classes by stealing their cities?

    Also is expander/explorer/partisian combination useful with certian race/class?

    • This reply was modified 4 years, 8 months ago by  notme.
    #257343

    Windscion
    Member

    1 Hover is quite weak for an ultimate. Roads + logistics + bridges moves your units around faster, at least inside your territory.
    2 You need to let go of your obsession with defense. Attack! Extermin — er, Attack! Attack!
    3 Rogue v a team of 7 is utterly useless because they WILL disjunct everything you cast, making your strategic spells a waste of mana. And strategic spells are a big thing for Rogues, used to cripple the enemy’s economy.

    4a Expander depends upon the map: large maps w/ few or no cities and dwelling, for example, make it better. Class and race are less important.
    4b Explorer I don’t much care for, but its capstone reveals the entire map which is no bad thing. Most classes have dedicated scouts units anyway. (Exception: Druids.)
    4c Partisan probably works better with mobility classes (i.e., not Dreadnought), but its another special I avoid.

    #257346

    notme
    Member

    2. It was hypothetical question – I was asking out if curiosity.
    How to attack players without leaving cities to other ais and hostile independents?

    #257366

    Gloweye
    Member

    It’s really easy – have your back to the edge of the map. That way, any hostile army coming your way has to go through your army.

    You achieve this by having multiple armies, all scouting their own direction. So while your main army is clearing sites between you and your enemy, you should build other stacks to clear the lands behind your back. Once that’s clear, nothing will get in there.

    Using just one stack is just a bad tactic. Unlike crappy games like Heroes, there’s no stack limit. Abuse it.

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