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Garresh 5 years, 5 months ago.
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Welcome to the Open Beta of version 1.7+!
This is going to be a short open beta designed to fix some exploits that are currently affecting PBEM games, we hope to have the beta end within 2 weeks at latest probably before.
The main three things this patch is designed to fix are:
- Players dragging out tactical battles to get multiple uses of the Healing ability, which lets them power level. Rather than nerfing Healing itself, which might have had big knock-on effects on the Theocrat, we targeted the heroes, so that no heroes could gain an on cooldown healing ability.
- Players using Mind Control to build up huge armies without needing to build them themselves. We obviously don’t want to remove the mind control mechanic itself, but have taken steps to try and ensure it doesn’t turn up until later in the game
- Players dragging out fights by spamming touch abilities to try and farm XP. The system now remembers when a unit uses a touch ability, and ensures they only get XP for using it once per battle.
Please bear this in mind when giving feedback on the changes that have been made.
How to switch to the Continued Open Beta?
- Right Click ‘Age of Wonders 3’ in your Steam Library and select ‘Properties’ from the menu that appears.
- Select the ‘BETAS’ tab in the ‘Properties’ window.
- Set the combobox to ‘open_beta’.
- Close the ‘Properties’ window.
- Start the game to force an update.
Or watch the start of the following video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fdej8kmdB3Q
Beware!
It’s a beta, so things might crash or malfunction. This can cause you to lose progress or wreck save games, so only switch to the beta if you are willing to take that risk ; )>Also note that if you are playing online multiplayer or PBEM matches everyone in the match needs to move into the beta branch if you do. I suggest switching back – opting out of beta – when playing PBEM games, unless everyone agrees on moving into the beta.
Patch Notes
Latest Changes – 6/10/2015
- Freezing Touch, Frost Aura, Inflict Frozen Paralysis, Inflict Frostbite and Inflict Chilling now affect machines and boats
- The modding tools now create a backup of a ACP file before saving it to help prevent data loss. The backupwill have the extension .~acp
- Rogues now get Invisibility at level 7 for 4 points (this only affects the hero, not their stack)
Version 1.703
- Fixed some options in the launcher where polish and french translations were swapped
- Hasty Plunder now takes 2 turns to destroy a city, not 1
- Quick Dash now heals 15hp (was 10)
- Arch Druids now get Nourishing Meal at level 3 (was Healing at level 3)
- Arch Druid now gets Healing at level 9 (was 3)
- Archdruid now gets Befriend Animal at level 3 (was 5), cost is 3 points (was 2)
- Arch Druids now get Spirit Of The Land and Natural Immunity at level 1 (was 5)
- Arch Druids now get Nature’s Resistance for 3 points (was 4)
- Theocrat’s Healing Aura now costs 3 points (was 4)
- Theocrats now get Bestow Iron Heart at level 1 (was Healing)
- Theocrat now gets Healing at level 7 (was 1)
- Theocrats now get Chaplain at level 1 (was 3) cost is 3 points (was 4)
- Theocrats now get Convert at level 7 (was 5)
- Theocrats no longer have Control Undead at level 7
- Heal Undead is now strength 25 (was 20) and once per battle (was 2 turn cooldown)
- Necromancers now get Reanimate Lesser Undead for 4 points (was 7)
- Necromancers now get Reanimate Greater Undead for 6 points (was 10) at level 7 (was 11)
- Necromancers now get Control Undead at level 5 (was 3)
- Dreadnaughts now get Guardian Flame at level 3 instead of Bestow Iron Heart at level 3
- Dreadnoughts now get Bomb Squad for 5 points (was 10)
- Dreadnought Heroes now get “Emergency Repair” instead of repair machine, a once per battle heal that fixes 25 damage.
- Engineers now get “Emergency Repair” instead of repair machine at gold medal, a once per battle heal that fixes 25 damage.
- Nymphs will no longer be given as rewards for clearing the Spring Of Life, Creation Node or Great Farm
- Added the Dire Monkey to Summon Wild Animal and Call Beast Horde
- Added the Dire Monkey as a defender/reward for Great Farms
- Rogue heroes now start with +2 defense (was +1)
- The Rogue hero’s +1 physical damage bonus for ranged attacks, now gives +1 on another channel for non-physical attacks
- Rogue Blowpipe now shoots Acid Darts as well as Normal Darts
- Acid Darts is now 3 blight, 4 fire (was 4/3)
- Rogues now get Inflict Crippling wounds at level 1 (was 9) for 3 points (was 5)
- Rogues now get Charm at level 5 (was 9)
- Rogues now get Shadow Step at level 9, 5 points
- Rogues now get Invisibility at level 7 for 4 points (this only affects the hero, not their stack)
- Harmonizing Energy now heals everything (previously didn’t affect machines or undead)
- Invigorate now has a 2 turn cooldown
- Were Bear ability now requires 3 action points to be used, but leaves the user with one action point afterwards (like Phase)
- War Cry now lets units do more damage to obstacles as well as units
- Fixed an issue with birds disappearing in deep water
- Settlers now cost 250g (was 200)
- Unit abilities that do no damage now only grant XP to their user once per battle
- Reduced number of times tier 2,3 and 4 units can be attacked and still grant XP (XP for kills is unaffected by this)
- Fixed an issue with the launcher in Steam, where sometimes the list of User Content wouldn’t properly appear
- Nightwish is now Tier 4 (was 5) 400 knowledge (was 700), casting cost is 60 (was 100), maintain cost is 5 (was 20)
- Reassemble is now Tier 4 (was 3), 450 knowledge (was 180), Hero Upgrade is available from level 7 (was 5)
- Heptatopia now counts Towns, not cities of any size
- Fixed a bug that meant sometimes the Empire Quest system wouldn’t recognize that you had a metropolis
- Bards now have 41 hp (was 46), recieve Inspiring Aura on Gold Medal (was High Morale)
- Charm is now Short Range (was touch)
- Victory Rush now heals 10hp after battle (was 12)
- Freezing Touch, Frost Aura, Inflict Frozen Paralysis, Inflict Frostbite and Inflict Chilling now affect machines and boats
- The modding tools now create a backup of a ACP file before saving it to help prevent data loss. The backupwill have the extension .~acp
Hmm, problem about bestoriw iron heart – it kills human priest attack with 100% spirit immunity, very very problematic here. I suggest you find a way to change this somehow.
I personally hate this change I must say, this is really a bad set of changes in my opinion.
Why not simply push healing to level 4 for Theocrat? simple solution. Worthwhile ability. Let it keep its sustain buff as is, but on level two (the +6HP army regen)
A single target buff that makes a unit to immune to another unit isn’t that much of an issue surely. He can only use it one one target per battle, and it’s not like Humans don’t have other units.
Quick update, I forgot 2 things:
- Theocrats no longer have Control Undead at level 7
- Necromancers now get Control Undead at level 5 (was 3)
Why not simply push healing to level 4 for Theocrat? simple solution. Worthwhile ability. Let it keep its sustain buff as is, but on level two (the +6HP army regen)
Well, I explained already why. I don’t want any hero to have an On Cooldown heal ability, at all. When I was asking people, a majority actually wanted Healing itself to be Once per Battle, but the minority said it would break too many things (like the Theocrat) so this is the compromise.
Also, many people think the game had too much healing in it in general, this patch aims to reduce the amount of healing a little bit, obviously the Theocrat is going to be affected the most.
Can I ask what caused these changes to healing abilities? I feel like all the hero units were fine. I do like bestow iron heart being moved up for the dreadnought, it makes that hero a more desirable draft.
The convert abilities moved back also makes sense, I wonder that control undead wasn’t also pushed back.
The convert abilities moved back also makes sense, I wonder that control undead wasn’t also pushed back.
It was, I just forgot to add it to the patch notes. It’s added now.
Can I ask what caused these changes to healing abilities? I feel like all the hero units were fine. I do like bestow iron heart being moved up for the dreadnought, it makes that hero a more desirable draft.
Well it’s like I said in the first post:
Players dragging out tactical battles to get multiple uses of the Healing ability, which lets them power level. Rather than nerfing Healing itself, which might have had big knock-on effects on the Theocrat, we targeted the heroes, so that no heroes could gain an on cooldown healing ability.
I’m not sure what I can add to be honest.
Oh, oops. I skimmed past all that. Sorry.
Necromancers now get Reanimate Lesser Undead for 4 points (was 7)
Necromancers now get Reanimate Greater Undead for 6 points (was 10) at level 7 (was 11)Horrible change. It buffs Necro enormously and provides new exploits in PBEM.
All it really means is the necro can get the abilities a bit faster than they did before though, it’s nothing new, surely the exploits were already there?
The main idea was that I wanted to make Heal Undead once per battle, but this was obviously a big blow to the Necromancer, so I made the reanimate abilities cheaper to compensate.
Could we agree on needing 5 points for Lesser Reanimate Dead, 7 or 8 for Greater Reanimate Dead and 10 (instead 7) for Inflict Ghould Curse?
I also wonder: is the nerf to Death March the Healing “nerf”? Or did I miss something?
I’m willing to push the prices up a little bit, sure, if others are agreeable. However, having Heal Undead on Once Per Battle is really big nerf, even with the +5hp power. I’d like some people to actually play with a bit too make sure the class is still competitive before I go an undo some of the buffs I put in to compensate.
As for Death March, I haven’t changed it at all. I did try to mitigate the abusability of it by reducing healing from Heroes. If that isn’t sufficient, a small nerf to Death March can still be done.
Ok, I read again “you didn’t “nerf” the spell directly.
To repeat what I don’t like with the spell the way it works:
1) No counter and unique
2) Total control of initiativeon the attack (in enemy territory)
3) Not “mundane” anough for a spell of that order.I mean, shouldn’t it be a spell you can use to accelerate things a bit, instead of being able to put tons of tressure up?
As I said: 50% and Exhausted Fatigue, maybe for 25 Mana. You can make use of it, are severely handicapped in a fight, but you don’t have this kind of do-or-die behinf it.
I did read through your reasoning, however I also read through a lot of reasoning from people who disagree with you. I’m just wondering if it would not be enough to make the spell more expensive to cast or research (or both)? Pushing the health penalty up to 60% could be done as well.
To be honest, I’d also rather have a solution that didn’t involve me having to change the description of the ability, since I’d need to mess around trying to get it all translated.
I’m willing to push the prices up a little bit, sure, if others are agreeable. However, having Heal Undead on Once Per Battle is really big nerf, even with the +5hp power. I’d like some people to actually play with a bit too make sure the class is still competitive before I go an undo some of the buffs I put in to compensate.
As for Death March, I haven’t changed it at all. I did try to mitigate the abusability of it by reducing healing from Heroes. If that isn’t sufficient, a small nerf to Death March can still be done.
Tombles I’m willing to bet, that it’s actually a buff for Live MP, because of the raise to 25 points. Hiring a 2nd Necro immediately you have 50 points in battle and 50 points between turns, regular regeneration would be 36, so make the math yourself. Once you can enlist Reanimators things proceed rather smoothly on all levels – keep in mind, you also get better troops than the other Classes (at start), so I wouldn’t be too worried about Necro. 🙂
Tombles I’m willing to bet, that it’s actually a buff for Live MP, because of the raise to 25 points.
You may well be right, keeping track of all this stuff is a nightmare for all the different game modes. It’s definitely a big nerf for single player, campaign and PBEM play though!
I did read through your reasoning, however I also read through a lot of reasoning from people who disagree with you. I’m just wondering if it would not be enough to make the spell more expensive to cast or research (or both)? Pushing the health penalty up to 60% could be done as well.
To be honest, I’d also rather have a solution that didn’t involve me having to change the description of the ability, since I’d need to mess around trying to get it all translated.
Yeah, but a lot of people were also reasoning Death March would be unusable for Warlord Scouting when I brought it up last year, a lot of people were not believing that you can ghoul the hell out of the game as soon as you get control over a Death Bringer (resulting in giving mind control), and a lot of people are disagreeing about Healing.
What I simply don’t understand is the need to have such un unwieldy club at all – compare this with combat. IImagine you had the same spell in combat: DOUBLE turns for 6 units plus loss of Half HPs.
EVERYONE would cry foul play. Why? Because a) loss of Health was insubstantial because it’s YOUR turn; b) no counter c) unfair. EASILY descisive in a tough battle where winning counts.
Now, I don’t bring this up, because I have fun with it but of course you have to take another thing into consideration here: There are structures on the map that let you replenish your full health, there are also structures that give you regrowth and there are structures that give you webbing and whatnot. See that in combination.
Also think about a Warlord hiring a Necro, developing him to level 5+, controling stuff – Death March, Well of Souls, Haste Berries, game over.All it really means is the necro can get the abilities a bit faster than they did before though, it’s nothing new, surely the exploits were already there?
The main idea was that I wanted to make Heal Undead once per battle, but this was obviously a big blow to the Necromancer, so I made the reanimate abilities cheaper to compensate.
Buff to Necro resurgence is much bigger than nerfs to heal. For example, after this change you can’t lose your starting T3s no more.
I’m willing to push the prices up a little bit, sure, if others are agreeable. However, having Heal Undead on Once Per Battle is really big nerf, even with the +5hp power. I’d like some people to actually play with a bit too make sure the class is still competitive before I go an undo some of the buffs I put in to compensate.
Prices don’t matter. Combat resurgence for units of ANY tier on level 7 (!!!) in manual battles (most typical scenario in PBEM) is straight forward OP.
Ok, I read again “you didn’t “nerf” the spell directly.
you are like the only person arguing for this, i don’t think it should come as a terribly big surprise
Tombles I’m willing to bet, that it’s actually a buff for Live MP, because of the raise to 25 points.
i dunno about you but i’m pretty ok with a buff to necro in live MP. plus it’s not like having multiple healings in a combat doesn’t affect live MP, it just isn’t something you can abuse every single turn like you can in PBEM.
What I simply don’t understand is the need to have such un unwieldy club at all – compare this with combat. IImagine you had the same spell in combat: DOUBLE turns for 6 units plus loss of Half HPs.
if quick dash gave back full MP and took away half health instead of healing health, i can’t say i’d be immediately crying foul
Buff to Necro resurgence is much bigger than nerfs to heal. For example, after this change you can’t lose your starting T3s no more.
if they survive until you’re at level 7, sure. much like it used to be true for level 10.
Prices don’t matter. Combat resurgence for units of ANY tier on level 7 (!!!) in manual battles (most typical scenario in PBEM) is straight forward OP.
i disagree. maybe you should do something besides state simple opinions as plain, irrefutable facts.
Theocrats now get Healing Aura at level 3 (was level 1)
I’d say don’t put this in, let Theo keep Healing Aura as IS. It should have a unique healing advantage early on.
I have suggested that ROGUE also receives something similar, e.g. FIELD MEDIC, HEALING AURA ETC, and I suggest it be placed fairly early.
I’d also like to point you to this thread short thread:
I liked the changes, Theo heroes will suffer the most from the changes, but they WERE the strongest of the party leader heroes, so it is fine. Since you guys are changing Heroes I would like to suggest you decrease a bit the cost of Bomb Squad and Tree Crusher Abilities of Dreadnought, they are not worth the price, in my experience, they are fun abilities, mostly situational, but too expensive.
Something like 5 for Tree Crusher and 7-8 to Bomb Squad, it is my suggestion, but can be other numbers.
For PBEM (and SP) the changes in Healing are a big nerf indeed because they simply make exploits impossible, of the kind:
Attack Site. AI waits. Round of Healing. Shamble into position. Second round of healing. Open hostilities – third round of Healing at end of hostilities.@ NINJEW
Nonsense example: Think INVIGORATE. Now give MASS Invigorate (for all units within a certain radius) for Half Health (HALF of the ACTUAL health, not maximum health). Still not good?Look, the reason why I’m (am I?) the only one pointing the finger is – I don’t shy away from losing half of my health, when the situation is right.
You should also try the effect of Death March with a stack of Warbreeds – or better: NAGAS. If Regrowth is not enough, Slip Away is doing the rest.
Or isn’t that still not giving you the creeps, imagining that freight train coming over you?
It’s OVERPOWERED because of the double movement – and no HP penalty in the world will stop you from using Slip Away and gain your Health back.
When you play MP you just don’t have the balls to do it, because you need time and a calm mind to act it out, and in Live MP it’s messy and stressful without a bunch of experience doing it – and I think Warlord isn’t that popular either.So. Go figure.
i disagree. maybe you should do something besides state simple opinions as plain, irrefutable facts.
Maybe, you should try to test all types of abuse of Necro Reanimate in full manual battles?
You should also try the effect of Death March with a stack of Warbreeds – or better: NAGAS. If Regrowth is not enough, Slip Away is doing the rest.
How is this news?
You’re arguing to nerf the ability now based on being able to use the penultimate Warlord Unit or Naga with it.
When you play MP you just don’t have the balls to do it, because you need time and a calm mind to act it out, and in Live MP it’s messy and stressful without a bunch of experience doing it – and I think Warlord isn’t that popular either.
Wrong on all counts here.
WL is quite popular now.
I have used exactly this in MP. Infact I remember discussing the viability of Warbreeds versus Manticores precisely because of being able to do this.Can I ask that DN receives instead of Bestow Iron Heart, which gives Spirit Immunity, Guarded by Flames?
It seems to me to a bit more thematically fitting (just a wee bit), goes with the entire fire theme here, and doesn’t give more spirit immunity to the machine class.
That’s a good idea ExNihil, I like it. I’ll add it to a list of tweaks to make on Monday.
I have suggested that ROGUE also receives something similar, e.g. FIELD MEDIC, HEALING AURA ETC, and I suggest it be placed fairly early.
I suggested this to a bunch of people and people generally disliked it because they felt all the classes would end up feeling the same. That’s why I buffed the heal from Quick Dash a bit, so it would mean that Rogue at least had some type of heal access.
Something like 5 for Tree Crusher and 7-8 to Bomb Squad, it is my suggestion, but can be other numbers.
Noted!
I suggested this to a bunch of people and people generally disliked it because they felt all the classes would end up feeling the same. That’s why I buffed the heal from Quick Dash a bit, so it would mean that Rogue at least had some type of heal access.
Well, the problem emerges here in full as a disparity in sustain. Since this is a beta I suggest this is something that is TRIED. Quick Dash is a spell, and an expensive one at that, which is usually only available on rogue heroes and not to rogue players themselves, who are thus without any form of heal whatsoever within class at all. My suggestion of Healing Aura or whatever is meant to offer a way to boost sustain in all moduses of game play, I don’t think they will homogenize the game – make this a level 3 or 4 ability for Rogue, which is different from what WL and Theo get, or give some sort of heal to Bards.
I suggested this to a bunch of people and people generally disliked it because they felt all the classes would end up feeling the same. That’s why I buffed the heal from Quick Dash a bit, so it would mean that Rogue at least had some type of heal access.
Actually, a bunch of people supports idea of Rogue passive healing. Quick dash isn’t enough. As for me I’d like to see old Quick dash, but with Field medic on Rogue heroes.
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