Update v1.51 Patch Notes – UPDATED 24/4/2015

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Home Forums Update v1.5 – Open Beta Update v1.51 Patch Notes – UPDATED 24/4/2015

This topic contains 244 replies, has 51 voices, and was last updated by  Narvek 6 years, 4 months ago.

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  • #187363

    Jolly Joker
    Member

    @ Tombles

    It looks like you misread my comment about Sun Guard. I think the change is very, very bad.

    I gave my reasoning in the 1.51 patch thread, but the gist of it is, that I think you can change the bad autocombat situation for the Sun Guard simply by changing the order in which Guard Breaker, Coup de Grace and Projectile Reflection is given: just start the unit by an inherent Coup de Grace, and add the other two as medals. By the time Sun Guard has Guard Breaker (and reason for the AI to recklessly attack), it will be so many medals better.

    The Sun Guard is an interesting unit – don’t throw it away by making it foolproof AND insanely good.

    #187375

    ArcaneSeraph
    Member

    The balance to White Witches wasn’t solely based on synergy towards one class.

    Based on? Anyone can just declare it so but some more info if you are in the know would be appreciated. Tombles seemed to indicate that was the main issue.

    Freezing actually provides the unit with resistance to the damage the white witches do so it’s a bit of a mixed blessing to begin with. Storm sisters have inflict stun, stunning touch, total awareness, and more damage. In general that makes the storm sisters a superior unit.

    I guess part of it is I found it to be an interesting strategy in combination with frost queens. Stand adjacent to a heavy hitter and try to freeze it with white witches. Not saying the white witch is useless or underpowered or overpowered… just that it was a relatively unique ability that opened up some strategies that now are diminished.

    The only fix I can see though is to disallow a unit having both abilities at the same time. If it has inflict stun it can’t get inflict freezing cold and visa versa.

    #187384

    I’m not on board with the prowler changes. It’ll basically become a significantly worse berseker with CdG. Seems a waste of unit whose abilities are part of the early racial synergies.
    If it is too powerful as T1 it either needs another nerf than significant cost increase or if it needs to become a T2 it needs some more buffs than some more HP.

    Also I dislike the exceptions to the ghoul curse for the Arch Angel and dragons.
    I simply see no reason for them to be unghoulable. Not from a game balance perspective and not from a lore perspective.

    Also is there an ETA for the patch?
    I will be very busy the next days and do want to finish my current game without those annoying changes.

    Dammit, now I need a Crystal Tree + Dungeon combo settled and established before building them. (Yes, I have issues. Can we get a creature upgrade function yet so I can have some fun with early units despite my damage? :P )

    You forget the Castle of the Lich King. You need that too.

    #187401

    Bob5
    Member

    Well I agree with Prowler changes, they were way too good for their price. Compare them to Tigran Assassins. Tigran assassins cost 90 gold 20 mana to produce, while Prowlers now cost 80/60 gold, depending on racial governance upgrades. Comparing them in rogue conditions yields the following similarities:

    Backstab
    Improved Wall Climbing
    Inflict Bleeding Wounds at Gold
    Coup de Grace
    Bloodthirsty
    Forestry
    Forest concealment

    Assassins get more damage on their melee attack, 10 phys, 4 blight, vs 13 phys, and get Assassin’s Strike, Mountain, and Urban Concealment. Assassins also get Noxious Vulnerability at bronze, and Pounce and Crippling Wounds at gold which Prowlers don’t get. Prowlers on the other hand get Martial Arts (very good), Cave Crawling, and Cave Concealment on silver medal. Assassins also benefit from Explorer upgrades, so they can get quite a bit faster with those. Apart from Martial Arts the two have very similar bulk, both have 8 resistance. Prowlers have 10 defense 52HP, Assassins 11 defense 50HP. Overall I think Assassins are better, but not by so much that they should cost twice as much as Prowlers. Martial Arts is a very good ability that significantly increases their bulk, but Assassins can afford with slightly less bulk as they can finish off their enemies a bit easier thanks to more damage output, especially on Assassin’s Strike, and Pounce at gold. With both Pounce and Assassin’s Strike they can perform two unretaliated attacks before having to really suffer retaliation strikes.

    Now lets compare them to Tigran Berserkers under Warlord conditions. Both have the same HP, def, MP, melee damage, and resistance. Both also get Bloodthirsty and Improved Wall Climbing, and with Martial Arts training Berserkers also get Martial Arts (MA doesn’t stack multiple times as far as I know so Prowlers don’t benefit). Now Berserkers get a couple of advantages:
    -Earlier Bleeding wounds (Bronze vs Gold)
    -Pounce
    -Charge
    -Mind Control Immunity
    -Overwhelm
    -Tireless at Gold
    Prowlers also get a bunch of advantages:
    -Martial Arts without having to get the research, which usually comes a bit later in the game
    -Cave Crawling
    -Cave Concealment at silver
    -Forestry
    -Forest Concealment
    -Coup de Grace

    overall I’d say the Berserkers are better at pure battle things, but they also are a bit more expensive. I wouldn’t say though that Prowlers should be much cheaper than Berserkers, after all Charge can also be gotten through the leader with Charge command and Martial Arts is great in earlier game. 80/60 gold is fine compared to 90 gold + 15 mana.

    #187405

    Weltenreiter
    Member

    Regarding Witches, freezing stuff up was pretty fun, and obviously an intended part of Frostling playstyle. Since we now apparently are intended to keep Ice Scapers around for that part past the very early game, any chance to give them some love in Military Patron too?

    #187421

    Weltenreiter
    Member

    You forget the Castle of the Lich King. You need that too.

    *Shakes fist at Ferrus*

    #187424

    esadbaf
    Member

    Liking a lot of the changes so far. Frostlings and especially Tigrans can out of the gate really fast in my opinion and I’m glad to see the other races getting buffed up a bit to compensate.

    Along those lines, 3 of the 9 races will now have an extra tier 2 unit. I was wondering if there are any plans to give the other 6 an extra tier 2?

    #187425

    Compare them to Tigran Assassins.

    I do think that the type difference does make the comparison harder.

    Now lets compare them to Tigran Berserkers under Warlord conditions. Both have the same HP, def, MP, melee damage, and resistance

    Berserkers have 1 more Def.

    But as you show, Prowlers are a cheaper, version of offensive class infantry that is worse at fulfilling the same function.
    At the same time they are the initial Bloodthirsty unit for Tigran, which is what the entire racial combat synergy works around. And now one part of that is going to be significantly more expensive in the early game.
    I find that to be a bad approach. Similarly how Frostlings are built around (chill-)freeze-shatter, Tigrans are glass cannons whose early military design is (guard break-)bleed-bloosthirsty. Now the last step of this is made significantly harder to maintain. And for 20 resources more you get the mystic whose alternate form provides a similarly useful set of skills in addition to the ranged firepower.

    Prowlers are a very good infantry unit for T1, but if shifted to T2 they make the combat interactions of Tigran far less visible and makes armies that want to use this interaction more expensive to maintain. At the same time there is a bunch of T2 bloodthirsty units that besides a severe production or resource scarcity provide a more versatile chassis for very little extra.

    Currently Prowlers are the T1 unit that exploits the openings the other T1 units create. If moved to T2 it will be one of multiple that does with its defining features being an RG bonus and that it’s kinda decent but nothing too special compared to its alternatives. And IMHO that is a loss.
    I’d rather have them lose martial arts and stay T1, to keep the Tigran bleed synergies spread through the entire roster.

    Regarding Witches, freezing stuff up was pretty fun, and obviously an intended part of Frostling playstyle. Since we now apparently are intended to keep Ice Scapers around for that part past the very early game, any chance to give them some love in Military Patron too?

    In that regard: How difficult would it be for School of Enchantment to instead provide inflict shocking to the Frost Witches?

    #187432

    Based on? Anyone can just declare it so but some more info if you are in the know would be appreciated. Tombles seemed to indicate that was the main issue.

    It wasn’t really fair to give Theocrats and Necromancers and AD a support based stun that is also supremely useful for removing weaknesses and buffing damage (AD longbows work super duper well with frozen flame, the frostling shaman does frost damage, Necromancers love frost, and theocrats got two stunning, healing units, and it can utilize spirit damage against the frozen units).

    But yes, the problem was that you could phase in, frost dome up the enemy and freeze/stun them en mass, and then have the white witches stun/freeze the remainder.

    #187442

    ArcaneSeraph
    Member

    It wasn’t really fair to give Theocrats and Necromancers and AD a support based stun that is also supremely useful for removing weaknesses and buffing damage (AD longbows work super duper well with frozen flame, the frostling shaman does frost damage, Necromancers love frost, and theocrats got two stunning, healing units, and it can utilize spirit damage against the frozen units).

    But yes, the problem was that you could phase in, frost dome up the enemy and freeze/stun them en mass, and then have the white witches stun/freeze the remainder.

    I understand what you are saying but in some ways hasn’t this change just made this even more unbalanced to the sorcerer then? Now the ONLY class that can phase in do a double freeze stun and then have the white witches stun the rest is the sorcerer! So whereas before anyone playing frostling could employ this type of tactic which, IMO, represents the core of the frostling play style (freezing and cold damage synergy) now only the sorcerer can. I’m not sure removing it has done anything but increased the power of the sorcerer.

    The frostlings have 2 support units which makes them unique. But they lose a T3 heavy hitter as a result. The frost queen is okay but damage wise isn’t great. It’s her ability to weaken other units by breaking guard and lowering frost resistance that makes her shine. She needs other units to support her. The white witch is a key frostling unit that is required to compensate for fire weakness, boost the somewhat weaker damage of many frostling units, and to target the victims of dome of frost. The other frostling units often require the white witch and frost queen to be there to form a cohesive fighting unit.

    My point is that yes white witches are powerful and can buff many classes. However the white witch needs to be powerful to compensate for other racial weaknesses (low T3 unit damage, low range damage, low fire resist). The ability to freeze is certainly powerful but it is not as though the frostlings have no weaknesses.

    The AD longbow does benefit from frozen flames but that’s a single unit. Dragon ancestry does as well. Elves also have a support stunner that is more survivable and doesn’t need to waste a turn on a buff as the elves no range penalty longbows get more damage output from their hunters/longbowmen than frostling equivalents right away.

    Necromancers do frost damage but that doesn’t seem to be a compelling reason to remove the ability to freeze.

    Theocrats get stunners that heal with the elves too and have additional buffs with other races (guardian flame, dragon ancestry, etc). Yes as frostlings theocrats get 2 stunning / healing units. However that’s because frostlings don’t have a T3 heavy hitter. Other races get fliers or heavy cavalry with their own benefits / drawbacks. The frost queens can’t stand up to other races’ T3 directly so it’s only natural to get some benefit from having 2 supports.

    So I understand what you are saying and concur with some of it but it seems to me this change ignored the drawbacks of the frostlings. Also it seems that by removing freezing the too powerful combo of being able to phase stun freeze with projectile resistance only rests with the sorcerer now – IMO a worse imbalance than was present before. I believe something needs to be done to avoid the dbl stun / freeze combo but I’m not sure that removing freezing cold has actually done much for overall balance.

    #187458

    Hello,
    I’ve no clue if this is the right place to post this as I’m new here.

    I was playing a game a few days ago (before patch I think) as a pure good character. Here are some odd behaviors I noticed from the AI and the game in general:

    -the ai necromancer tigran (you know, the one with double shadowborn for magic schools) was instantly ‘friendly’ empire status from the moment we met because he was pure good in alignment

    -The oddest behavior I saw was from multiple ai empires who were good (or neutral-good) in alignment, with who I was friendly or neutral with from the moment we met. They kept sending their units into my terrain before retreating back onto their territory. They did this again and again for no purpose (glitch I think), causing our empire relationship to plummet due to them trespassing and them to go from good alignment to neutral or neutral to evil and to declare war on me. multiple empires did this. a workaround was simply allowing open borders

    -not a glitch, but I’d like to set up alliances (temporary or permanent) in a game where I started with no allies like we were able to do in Shadow Magic (if I remember correctly, shadow magic was a while ago).

    -another non glitch, but I found a kinda exploit-y sort of thing. if one of your remote, undefended cities is about to fall to approaching armies, all you have to do to save it is convert the city to a vassal and in a few terns a couple small armies will be there to defend it. Related, as pure good character+ keeper of good, it was really easy to defend my territory by having all outward facing cities (those neighboring other empires) as vassals so they have free units in place at all times

    -sorta glitch? I find it weird that frostlings don’t like arctic terrain

    #187459

    ArcaneSeraph
    Member

    Sorry for the double post but it occurs to me that an elegant solution to white witch issue would be to modify school of enchantment works. If it provided inflict freezing cold to frostling support units and inflict stun to all others it would prevent the too powerful stun / freeze combo but still allow the frostlings to keep their inflict freezing cold at gold medal naturally. It would put them in a similar position to the elves’ storm sisters who also get inflict stun at gold but would get it much earlier via school of enchantment.

    Now I realize that it may be tricky depending on how the skill system works in the engine to implement it this way, but to me it would be the most ideal solution.

    #187472

    Weltenreiter
    Member

    -sorta glitch? I find it weird that frostlings don’t like arctic terrain

    Not a glitch, races in general only like terrain features and not climate types, while dislikes and hates are only climates.

    #187495

    Fenraellis
    Member

    Sorry for the double post but it occurs to me that an elegant solution to white witch issue would be to modify school of enchantment works. If it provided inflict freezing cold to frostling support units and inflict stun to all others it would prevent the too powerful stun / freeze combo but still allow the frostlings to keep their inflict freezing cold at gold medal naturally. It would put them in a similar position to the elves’ storm sisters who also get inflict stun at gold but would get it much earlier via school of enchantment.

    First off, Storm Sisters for a Sorcerer gain no benefit from Gold rank(stats aside), so I’m not sure why this would suddenly make them ‘like a Storm Sister’…

    That being said, I do believe one of the primary concerns was actually the simple fact that Chilling reduces Frost Protection, which thus inherently increases Freeze chance. So they were a Support with a hard-cc, which can also drastically increase the chance of said hard-cc occurring due to their skill set. They did also happen the be the only racial Support which happened to have access to two forms of hard-cc while under a Sorcerer. Daze on Human Priests is close, but not quite there, and also significantly more resisted/immune than Freeze or Stun are.

    #187502

    Zaskow
    Member

    What cant they do? Rogue’s don’t do that much blight damage. Assassin is the only Rogue unit that inherently has blight damage.

    Actually, Rogue hasn’t any other type of damage, than blight except some racial variants.

    Blind, Smoke Screen, Quick Dash. Rogue is not lacking against Machine’s.

    Blind – pretty useless against machines, due their high defense.
    Smoke screen – useless against Flame tanks and Golems.
    Quick Dash is a good spell, but it doesn’t give a lot of preferences against machines.

    Rogue is not lacking against Machine’s.

    Try to capture city defended by cannons, flame tanks and juggernaut. Then return with result.

    Maybe Stalker shouldn’t even be an elemental? Even if we fix the reaper, I’m not sure that having the T4 being the only counter necro has for the SS is that great an idea. Not being an elemental would open it up to things like despair, berserk and panick attack.

    Other solutions are welcome! This isn’t the first time I’ve had complaints that necro can’t do anything vs shadow stalker.

    Removing despair immunity from elemntals could be considered as welll

    Pretty please, DON’T DO THIS!
    If players haven’t enough mind just to recruit some racial supports (storm sisters, elders, forge priests etc) it’s not a problem in game balance. It’s problem in player’s skill.

    Actually in my necro experience I had ZERO problems with stalkers just using banshees in masses and expert storm sisters.

    #187513

    Yeah, banshees work quite well for that. Frostlings ghouls, especially with frozen flame, also beat the tar out of the stalkers.

    Stalkers do lots of frost damage, so I don’t know what you are talking about for rogues. Smokescreen hides from ranged, and then stalkers/fire or frost damage units do the rest (based on racial variants).

    Golems fall per cost to scoundrels, so the only really tough unit is the flame tank. That is best dealt with by backstabbing flyers, jump jet pikes, or other race specific strategies.

    Another thing is that rogues should be stealthy, so they fall on isolated dread armies rather than trying to fight them straight on. It isn’t odd that the stealthiest class is weak when assaulting a fortified city of the most technological class.

    Garresh has some great rogue strategy stuff about how to sneek successfully.

    #187532

    Zaskow
    Member

    It isn’t odd that the stealthiest class is weak when assaulting a fortified city of the most technological class.

    Problem is that at some point you need to capture cities. Against AI you must be very lucky to find town with low garrison.

    Golems fall per cost to scoundrels, so the only really tough unit is the flame tank.

    Musketeers FTW!

    #187535

    llfoso
    Member

    1.4 made stalkers elementals (along with all the immunities) and gave them +1 resistance.

    I say leave them as elementals and take away the resistance point. I think that would be enough.

    #187539

    Musketeers FTW!

    smoke screen makes them quite ineffective. And rogues have armor piercing blight archers to fight muskets one on one. Works especially well with high elves (the longbow) or tigrans (pounce and shoot around corners).

    Tigrans are especially useful for Rogues (and especially useful for dreadnought fighting), because they come with lots of flame resistance, ability to close distance, and that magnificent solar beam.

    The new rot is also especially valuable, as it handles both undead and machines that many rogue units are unable to fight efficiently.

    #187589

    Hawkalypse
    Member

    I finally logged into the forums for the first time, after lurking since release, for the sole purpose of saying how disappointed I would be to see the White Witches lose their inflict freezing, it’s so fun and useful, as well as being delightfully thematic. The unit just wouldn’t have much use without it, and I can’t see using them for a dangerous and unreliable freezing touch.

    #187693

    Astraflame
    Member

    Human Longswordman now has attack 12 (was 11), and Guard Breaker on Gold medal (was Inflict Bleeding Wounds)

    Ah, excellent! 😀

    #187730

    Zaskow
    Member

    smoke screen

    Which is dispellable…

    #187754

    Kozzie
    Member

    i know that the necro is a new class and everybody likes new stuff, but these changes:

    1) Dark Ritual now affects enemy cities as well as friendly ones, cost is 50 mana (was 40), tier is 3 (was 2), research cost is 200 (was 120)

    2) Necromancers now get a 35% fixed bonus to race governance XP

    Are too big buffs for an already really good class.

    dark ritutal is the only Class spell that creates terrain that mosr races dislike/hate and its as cheap as 200 research point , to make things worse – it basically allows the necro to spawn 3 units next to any enemy city and use them to attack the city owner! – no other class can summon 3 units at one time!

    not to mention that Anyone without mastery specialization will be stuck with blight terrain in their cities – it will mean at least -200-300 pernament negative happiness from 1 lousy spell.

    for comaprison – a rogue needs to research incite revolt for 220 research (20 more than necro spell) cast the spell for 60 mana (again more cost than necro) and maintain the spell for another 40 mana /turn ! Ok it gives -600 morale but the necro can achive the same effect with 2 casts only and does not have to reaply it or maintain it on enemy city!

    the only comparable spell is wild growth that is 350 research and only creates some trees on someones terrain ,nothing more.

    2) Other races need to work to get their +% bonuses and settle favorable land (dwarfs have the worst time buffing their happiness) and usually have 25% bonus , sometimes 50%. And the race happiness will get lowered if they attack a city of their own race or rush buildings.

    I would suggest scraping the affects enemy cities part for dark ritual and lowering the necro bonus to 25% .

    #187765

    Narvek
    Keymaster

    In regards to Dark Ritual, we toyed around with this idea, then ultimately decided against it, but in all the busy scrambling trying to get all these changes in, we forgot to undo this change.

    We’ll do it in the next patch!

    #187795

    ArcaneSeraph
    Member

    First off, Storm Sisters for a Sorcerer gain no benefit from Gold rank(stats aside), so I’m not sure why this would suddenly make them ‘like a Storm Sister’…

    But you just said exactly what I said! If the White Witches got Inflict Freezing Cold from School of Enchantment instead of Inflict Stun then they would get no benefit from gold rank except for stat increases. Instead of having access to double hard-cc, as you call it, they’d have only one. Just like the storm sisters.

    That being said, I do believe one of the primary concerns was actually the simple fact that Chilling reduces Frost Protection, which thus inherently increases Freeze chance. So they were a Support with a hard-cc, which can also drastically increase the chance of said hard-cc occurring due to their skill set. They did also happen the be the only racial Support which happened to have access to two forms of hard-cc while under a Sorcerer. Daze on Human Priests is close, but not quite there, and also significantly more resisted/immune than Freeze or Stun are.

    Fair enough and I agree the double stun/freezing combo with sorcerer was too much hence why I suggested that School of Enchantment give some races supports inflict freezing (where appropriate) instead of inflict stun.

    But we are talking about a gold medal ranked unit here. One that has to trigger multiple chilling effects and or combine in synergy with another gold medal ranked unit. It’s not like you have hundreds of them running around! They are many units that are extremely dangerous at gold medal rank. If we start to remove all their abilities because one particular combination of units under a certain class at gold medal rank is powerful… I think the chopping block will be quite full!

    Inflict stun also has numerous ways of increasing its chance to trigger. Inflict shocking is twice as powerful as chilling (-40%) and available on quite a few units. There’s also static field. Sets up quite a few synergies there to almost guarantee a stun after a few hits. Now I’m not saying the frostlings white witches should be as good as an entire class all by themselves. But again these are gold medal units that require numbers or other units to trigger this effect. And they aren’t exactly that strong that they can’t be killed easily.

    While we are on the subject of inflict stun, why oh why did the high elf manticore rider get it, and at base level? I played as a HE WL all the time and felt like I was cheating on large / extra large maps already with my mounted archer spam. Now I also get an insanely powerful unit with inflict stun too right out the gate without global assault even!? I get racial diversity and I enjoy most of the changes but I think this one goes too far!

    I finally logged into the forums for the first time, after lurking since release, for the sole purpose of saying how disappointed I would be to see the White Witches lose their inflict freezing, it’s so fun and useful, as well as being delightfully thematic. The unit just wouldn’t have much use without it, and I can’t see using them for a dangerous and unreliable freezing touch.

    Agreed. We seem to be going in circles in some ways. We start by giving people certain disabling skills. Then we think they are too strong and give them touch abilities. Then we realize the touch abilities can’t be used without an almost assured death on failure. Then we give said units more buffs to allow them to be more survivable again to attempt to survive their touch disable attempt.

    That having been said, it’s very difficult to get the right balance and the devs have done an amazing job of it for the most part so kudos to them! I just don’t agree with a few.

    #187835

    Tombles
    Keymaster

    School of Enchantment was just the straw that broke the camel’s back, Inflict Freeze on the white witch is just too much and it’s not coming back.

    Look at it this way, if I were to put out a patch, and you guys read:

    • Storm Sisters now have Grant Gift of the Storm – Target unit (any unit) gains +3 light
      ning damage to all attacks, inflict shocking and +2 defense until the end of battle.
    • Storm Sisters now have Inflict Shocking
    • Storm Sisters no longer have stunning touch
    • Inflict Shocking now stacks

    What do you think would happen? I don’t want to put words in people’s mouths, but I suspect there would be an outcry of how OP the unit now was. However, this would make the storm sister the equal of the White Witch as she was before.

    The original WW had better crowd control than the Storm Sister (who was the support unit that specialized in crowd control), and better buffing than the Draconian Elder (who held the previous title of best buffing support unit), and debuffing abilities around the same level as the blight doctor (possibly better, far fewer things resist frost than resist blight).

    With this change at least she’s now only the best 2 of those categories, not 3. Frostlings still have freeze on the Ice Scaper and the Snow Queen. The White Witch still has Frozen Flames which is an amazing ability, she simply does not need Inflict Freeze on gold.

    #187858

    Tombles
    Keymaster

    24th April 2015, version 1.553

    • Most spells now list the resistance strength used to apply debuffs
    • Dread Reaper now has 8 spirit/8 blight/8 frost damage (was 8 physical/4 blight/8 frost)
    • Invoke Death will now work on Elementals
    • Suppress Nature will no longer be a starting spell
    • Tigran Sun Guard now has resistance 8 (was 7) and loses defensive strike, melee damage restored to 10.
    • Goblin Death Bringer now gets Inflict Weakened at gold, damage is 10 physical, 6 blight (was 13 physical, 3 blight)
    • Goblin Manticore Rider now gets Inflict Weakened
    • Goblin Military 5 now grants units Inflict Weakened instead of Inflict Severely Poisoned
    • Inflict Despair is now strength 10 (was 11)
    • Despair now applies -200 morale (was -300)
    • The AI will no longer use spells that damage cities while defending it’s own cities
    • Creating a cadavers from dead ghouls will no longer give you ghouled cadavers
    • Fixed players being able to disband units from the Entering Battle screen
    • Juggernaut now has Inflict Immolation on Gold, Free Movement is now on Bronze.
    • Fixed High Elf Mounted Archer not having Shoot Longbow (again)
    • Tigran Martyr now has Inflict Bleeding Wounds
    • Tigran Exalted now has Blood Thirsty
    • Tigran Apprentice now has magic bolts at 5/5 damage (was Fairy Fire at 3/3/3 damage), level ups have been modified to fit
    • Frostling Mounted Archer now has 6 physical/5frost melee damage (was 10 physical)
    • Draconian Death Bringer now has Improved Wall Climbing
    • Orc Martyr now has Throw Javelin instead of Throw Stones
    • Human Martyr now has Spirit Blast instead of Throw Stones, level ups have been modified to fit. Cost is 15 mana (was 10 mana)
    • Draconian Exalted now has Charge like the Charger and Flyer, cost is 170 gold (was 160)
    • Dwarf Exalted now has Shield, base cost is 170 gold (was 160)
    • Orc Bard now has Razor Projectiles
    • Draconian Scoundrel now has Improved Wall Climbing
    • Dwarf Scoundrel now has Armored, for a new defense of 10 (was 9), base cost is 50 (was 45)
    • Dwarf Succubus now has Projectilw Resistance base cost is 175 gold (was 170)
    • Orc Scoundrel now has Throw Javelin, not shoot light crossbow
    • Orc Monster Hunter now has Throw Javelin instead of Shoot Light Crossbow and sprint, cost is 80 gold (was 70)
    • Dwarf Mounted Archer now has Armored, for a new defense of 12 (was 11), no price change (he was already 5 gold too expensive)
    • Goblin Mounted Archer now has Overwhelm, base cost is 105gold (was 100)
    • Orc Phalanx now has War Cry, cost is 145 (was 140)
    • Dwarf Hunter now has Armored, for a new defense of 11 (was 10), base cost is now 80gold (was 75 gold)
    • Halfling Scoundrel now has Slingshot
    • Halfling Hunter now has Monster Slayer
    #187877

    syntax_vi
    Member

    Meh I logged in to agree RE white witch and freezing, as I think it helped the frostlings out considerably, but agreed it was probably OP on Sorcerer as well. Guess we will have to wait and see how it pans out. I liked the idea of School of enchantment not giving them stun, but freeze instead as a trade off, but probably too complex.

    What about Ghouled Fallen angels? I originally reported the inability of lich aura to make them ghouls but then realized how bad they are as ghouls (already had bight immunity, gain fire and extra spirit weakness and only gain a bit of frost res).

    They seem pretty weak when ghouled?

    #187881

    ArcaneSeraph
    Member

    @tombles Fair enough. I don’t exactly agree but I will accept the decision.

    The analogy is a bit flawed though, IMHO. The high elves already have superior ranged damage capabilities and highly mobile / strong hitters with a weakness to blight largely compensated for by their extra resistance out of the gate. The frostlings, on the other hand, suffer from greatly reduced ranged damage, a 40% fire weakness, and a lack of a heavy hitter or mobility. Frozen flames compensates for that weakness on a single unit and brings their ranged units up to barely comparable damage to other races let alone the elves. The buff you described would just further push the elves into the stratosphere ranged damage wise and enhance defence rather than compensate a weakness.

    So yes that storm sister buff would be too strong. However that is in the context of the race. In a race that requires operation as a team to stay competitive with the more straightforward heavy hitting races on the other hand it’s not quite as clear cut.

    Anyway… thanks for listening even if we don’t agree 🙂

    #187885

    Zaskow
    Member

    I’m very appreciated to see my suggestions in patch. Thanks you! You’re the most responsive developers that I saw!

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